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overman74@hotmail.com medicine forum Guru
Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 442
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Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2005 1:23 pm Post subject:
Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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Nat Immunol. 2001 Sep;2(9):797-801.
Autoimmunity provoked by infection: how good is the case for T cell
epitope mimicry?
Benoist C, Mathis D.
Section on Immunology and Immunogenetics, Joslin Diabetes Center,
Department of Medicine, Brigham and Women's Hospital, Harvard Medical
School, One Joslin Place, Boston, MA, USA.
Autoimmune diseases remain one of the mysteries that perplex
immunologists. What makes the immune system, which has evolved to
protect an organism from foreign invaders, turn on the organism itself?
A popular answer to this question involves the lymphoid network's
primordial function: autoimmunity is a by-product of the immune
response to microbial infection. For decades there have been
tantalizing associations between infectious agents and autoimmunity:
beta-hemolytic streptococci and rheumatic fever; B3 Coxsackieviruses
and myocarditis; Trypanosoma cruzi and Chagas' disease; diverse viruses
and multiple sclerosis; Borrelia burgdorfii and Lyme arthritis; and B4
Coxsackievirus, cytomegalovirus or rubella and type 1 diabetes, to name
the most frequently cited examples. In addition, animal models have
provided direct evidence that infection with a particular microbe can
incite a particular autoimmune disease. Nonetheless, many of the
associations appear less than convincing and, even for those that seem
to be on solid footing, there is no real understanding of the
underlying mechanism(s).
Publication Types:
* Review
PMID: 11526389 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] |
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brent medicine forum Guru
Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1543
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Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 12:52 am Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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On 2 Oct 2005 08:23:38 -0700, overman74@hotmail.com stated:
| Quote: | Nat Immunol. 2001 Sep;2(9):797-801.
Autoimmunity provoked by infection: how good is the case for T cell
epitope mimicry?
Benoist C, Mathis D.
Section on Immunology and Immunogenetics, Joslin Diabetes Center,
Department of Medicine, Brigham and Women's Hospital, Harvard Medical
School, One Joslin Place, Boston, MA, USA.
Autoimmune diseases remain one of the mysteries that perplex
immunologists. What makes the immune system, which has evolved to
protect an organism from foreign invaders, turn on the organism itself?
A popular answer to this question involves the lymphoid network's
primordial function: autoimmunity is a by-product of the immune
response to microbial infection. For decades there have been
tantalizing associations between infectious agents and autoimmunity:
beta-hemolytic streptococci and rheumatic fever; B3 Coxsackieviruses
and myocarditis; Trypanosoma cruzi and Chagas' disease; diverse viruses
and multiple sclerosis; Borrelia burgdorfii and Lyme arthritis; and B4
Coxsackievirus, cytomegalovirus or rubella and type 1 diabetes, to name
the most frequently cited examples. In addition, animal models have
provided direct evidence that infection with a particular microbe can
incite a particular autoimmune disease.
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Powerful argument for the infection model for disease.
| Quote: | Nonetheless, many of the
associations appear less than convincing and, even for those that seem
to be on solid footing, there is no real understanding of the
underlying mechanism(s).
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wtf? Nonetheless the evidence is slam dunk and autoimmunity is a
crock.
Some of these pubmeds are funny stuff.
| Quote: | Publication Types:
* Review
PMID: 11526389 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] |
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overman74@hotmail.com medicine forum Guru
Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 442
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 4:11 pm Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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I have been wondering if there is any "true" autoimmunity, or a mimic
that is stimulated by infection, active infection.
Some time ago, there was a published article that showed an autoimmune
marker becoming normal after treatment of an infection. Posted it
here, I think. Good stuff, but not sure I am up to searching for it
again. And besides, is anyone reading this, besides trolls and
pyschopaths (barring a few others)? |
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overman74@hotmail.com medicine forum Guru
Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 442
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:09 pm Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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Due to great demand, here is the abstract of an article in which a
condition that was considered autoimmune was cured by treating H.
pylori, an infectious cause, in other words.
Arch Intern Med. 2004 Sep 27;164(17):1904-7.
Effect of Helicobacter pylori eradication on platelet recovery in
patients with chronic idiopathic thrombocytopenic purpura.
Sato R, Murakami K, Watanabe K, Okimoto T, Miyajima H, Ogata M,
Ohtsuka E, Kodama M, Saburi Y, Fujioka T, Nasu M.
Second Department of Internal Medicine, Faculty of Medicine, Oita
University, Oita, Japan.
BACKGROUND: A relationship between Helicobacter pylori infection
and idiopathic thrombocytopenic purpura (ITP) has previously been
reported. We determined the prevalence of H pylori infection in
Japanese patients with chronic ITP and the effect of its eradication on
platelet count. METHODS: The study population comprised 53 Japanese
adults with chronic ITP and a platelet count of less than 100 x 10(3)/
micro L. A (13)C-urea breath test was performed to determine H pylori
infection status. Those patients who were H pylori positive gave
written informed consent and received eradication therapy. The effect
of H pylori eradication on platelet count was evaluated up to 6 months
after therapy. Clinical parameters were compared between responders to
the therapy (increase in platelet count) and nonresponders, as well as
between H pylori-positive and -negative patients. RESULTS: Of the 53
patients with chronic ITP in the study, 39 (74%) were H pylori
positive. Of the 32 infected patients who received treatment, H pylori
was successfully eradicated in 27 patients (84%). In 10 (37%) of these
patients, this resulted in a favorable platelet response. A partial
response was seen in 5 additional patients (19%). A significant
(P<.001) increase in platelet count was demonstrated in patients in
whom H pylori was successfully eradicated but not in patients who were
unsuccessfully treated or in untreated patients. Current corticosteroid
therapy was reported more often in nonresponders than in responders.
CONCLUSION: Eradication of H pylori may prove effective in increasing
platelet count in H pylori-positive patients with chronic ITP.
Publication Types:
* Clinical Trial
PMID: 15451766 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] |
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brent medicine forum Guru
Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1543
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:10 pm Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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overman74@hotmail.com wrote:
| Quote: | I have been wondering if there is any "true" autoimmunity, or a mimic
that is stimulated by infection, active infection.
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I've been wondering that myself. An argument for it would be
autoantibodies.
BUT I did a little searching and knew antibodies attack cancer cells
and came up with the below link. Also, so many autoimmune disease are
targetting one part of a host, a true autoimmune infection should, I
would think, be systemic and quickly fatal.
Scientists know that cancer patients produce antibodies to proteins,
called antigens, which are present on the surface of tumor cells.
Antibodies themselves are proteins produced by immune cells to help
fight and destroy viruses, bacteria, and other foreign substances that
invade the body. As a cancer cell grows, normal antigens can be
presented on a cell surface in a different way. The body then
recognizes these antigens as foreign and produces antibodies to these
cells. These particular antibodies are termed autoantibodies, because
they react to a substance produced by the body itself.
"In this study, we took advantage of the body's own immune system as a
detector of prostate cancer," said Arul Chinnaiyan, M.D., Ph.D., study
leader, University of Michigan Medical School, Ann Arbor. "While the
present study focused on the detection of prostate cancer, this general
approach has potential to be developed for other cancers, as well as
for other human diseases that in some way perturb the immune system."
the whole thing is a good read.
http://www.cancer.gov/newscenter/pressreleases/ProstateAutoantibody |
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overman74@hotmail.com medicine forum Guru
Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Posts: 442
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 9:24 pm Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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Makes my head spin.
Some of their numbers don't add up: up to 80% false positive with PSA
test, but accurate 79.6% of the time?
Any test that has 80% false positives is a worthless test. Why does
anyone do this? |
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brent medicine forum Guru
Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1543
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 9:28 pm Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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On 5 Oct 2005 12:09:48 -0700, overman74@hotmail.com stated:
| Quote: | Due to great demand
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lmao
I wonder what other diseases have the same effect as H pylori?
As for me I needed some drugs (forgot name) to boost my red cell
count.
As to who's listening.
I've heard stories.... |
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brent medicine forum Guru
Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1543
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Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 9:59 pm Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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On 5 Oct 2005 16:24:15 -0700, overman74@hotmail.com stated:
| Quote: | Makes my head spin.
Some of their numbers don't add up: up to 80% false positive with PSA
test, but accurate 79.6% of the time?
Any test that has 80% false positives is a worthless test. Why does
anyone do this?
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Given enough time the antigen shifts will eventually give everyone who
has borrelia a positive test. If of course one lives enough to take
enough tests.
I think a better and more accurate description is that these test are
not for testing for borrelia but more in the line of a cost cutting
device. |
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Martijn medicine forum Guru
Joined: 24 Mar 2005
Posts: 1004
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 7:14 am Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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dali wrote:
| Quote: | I wonder what other diseases have the same effect as H pylori?
As for me I needed some drugs (forgot name) to boost my red cell
count.
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Colloid Silver? |
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brent medicine forum Guru
Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1543
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Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:19 pm Post subject:
Re: Autoimmunity provoked by infection?
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Martijn wrote:
| Quote: | dali wrote:
I wonder what other diseases have the same effect as H pylori?
As for me I needed some drugs (forgot name) to boost my red cell
count.
Colloid Silver?
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Nope it was another allopathic drug. Sorry forgot the name and I can't
find it. Sounded like prevacid but I quickly realized that was not it.
The cost was about 2000 bucks and it's usually for cancer patients.
Worked great.
Whilst on the chase of finding the name i came accross this. very
interesting.
The researchers gave a single dose of the chemotherapeutic agent
5-fluorouracil to mice, and the next day gave some of the mice an
infusion of purified myeloid progenitor cells. They then exposed all of
the mice to a fungus that had killed a chemotherapy patient.
One week later, researchers found that the mice treated with the
cellular boost had significantly more neutrophils in their spleens,
blood and bone marrow than the ones that had not received the infusion.
More than half of the treated mice survived, while only a third of the
ones without it did.
http://med.stanford.edu/research/spotlight/archive/chemo_mice.html |
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