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Autism: It's not ancient, it's new.
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Jeff
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1313

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 12:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

The increase in obesity is real too. That doesn't mean that vaccines caused
the obesity epidemic or the autism epidemic.

Jeff
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Jeff
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1313

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 12:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

"john" <sc@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:-pqdnZRmTrWOMSnZnZ2dnUVZ8sydnZ2d@bt.com...
Quote:
As a pediatrician, who has been in practice for over two decades, I find
it more than a little insulting as well as disturbing to have someone say
that these children were always there. ..... For years the vaccine
division at the CDC and others have said the reason for the dramatic
increase in autism is due to "better diagnosing" and "greater awareness."
They have encouraged those like Paul Shattuck to manufacture uncertainty.
.... There are no studies that have found the previously undiagnosed or
misdiagnosed autistic individuals among older Americans. They simply
aren't there. We need to address the real reason for the alarming autism
rate. No more secrets or truth-spinning. This is not a faux
epidemiological epidemic, nor an infectious epidemic, nor a genetic
epidemic (as there are no genetic epidemics). That leaves an epidemic
linked to some sort of exposure. [Schafer Autism Report--Pediatrics
article May 2006] The Obfuscation of The Iatrogenic Autism Epidemic

Even if there is a real increase in the autism epidemic, that doesn't mean
vaccines are at fault. Vaccines are not at fault for the diabetes type II
epidemic. Not getting enough exercise, eating too much and watching too much
television are.

Jeff
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JohnDoe
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 364

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 12:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

Jeff wrote:

Quote:
"JohnDoe" <none@ofyourbusiness.com> wrote in message
news:44b4a20c$0$2016$ba620dc5@text.nova.planet.nl...
(...)


No, they won't. They oppose vaccines which have never and vaccines that no
longer contain any mercury in any form whatsoever. They want vaccines
banned, period. There is a reason why these people are referred to as
insane.


I don't think they are insane. Misled, certainly. But not insane.

Perhaps not all of them, particularly the followers. But I think Dr.
Kalokineros (am I spelling that name correct?), who claims that the WHO
and some other health organizations are deliberately murdering children
with vaccines, certainly qualifies. As do some other leaders in the
anti-vac movement.

Quote:
People don't necessarily think logically about some things. Medicine and
vaccines are clearly two areas where people don't think logically.


I hope they evolve into the anti-dental fillings crowd. I hope they
succeed in removing mercury from dental fillings.

I don't think they will. They couldn't care less about mercury in any form
from any source. They're agenda is to have vaccines banned. The
thimerosal-autism scare is only a means to an end for them, nothing more.
Just look at their resistance against the cervical cancer vaccine - there
it's 'promoting sexual promiscuity'. Or look at the Yurko case - there
vaccines were said to cause shaken baby syndrome.

This points to an inability to examine evidence and think.

Jeff


Once they win that battle, the next battle will be much more difficult
--keeping fish from becoming contaminated with mercury.

At least you seem sincere about removing any possible exposure to mercury
from all sources. And not just mercury, all other heavy metals. Which
makes you an order of magnitude more honest than the anti-vac crowd.


I can only hope so since my agenda is protecting children from mercury
and
other heavy metals. I am in favor of vaccines and would prefer they do
not
contain mercury. Even Jeff seems to believe that it would be a good thing
if mercury was removed from vaccines.

But not (as far as I can tell) because he sees a thimerosal-autism link,
but to err on the side of caution. And maybe to remove an argument from
the arsenal of the anti-vac crowd.


Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


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vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 2:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:59ednfF2Utr9zCnZnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com...
Quote:

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b418a2$0$23438$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:OYWdnWNYOJuIcS7ZnZ2dnUVZ_u-dnZ2d@comcast.com...

"john" <sc@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:zKadnfSe_YVzey7ZnZ2dnUVZ8smdnZ2d@bt.com...
this is one of the main lies to hide the vaccine
connection.http://www.whale.to/a/autism_diagnosis.html

"So the first lie to remember today is this: autism is ancient. It's
not ancient, it's new." ------Mark Blaxill, MBA



So havind a Masters in Business Administration makes him an expert in
the history of neurology?



History of neurology?

No one needs to know a thing about neurology to recognize or be around
the autistic.

That is, unless you are inferring that autism is secretive disease that a
Doctor must "discover" and thus treat.


Wow... you are as much an expert as someone with an MBA!


Just as everyone here thought. You don't even know what an autistic is or
the symptoms.
Keep it up, pharma toad, you support John more and more.

I can see it now. You fall and break your arm. Someone comes along an
comments that your arm is broken and offers help. You response is, "What
the hell do you know, you're just a store clerk"
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Bryan Heit
medicine forum Guru Wannabe


Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 3:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

Jeff wrote:
Quote:
Can you please provide data to support your contention that the major source
of mercury for kids is vaccines?

Jeff

Fombonne breaks it down pretty well in his most recent study, for ethyl
mercury:

http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/118/1/e139

Others have done a fair amount of work in the area, mostly with methyl
and metallic mercury:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15236954&query_hl=31&itool=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=16555611&query_hl=24&itool=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=16203251&query_hl=24&itool=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15674318&query_hl=24&itool=pubmed_DocSum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15691220&query_hl=31&itool=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=15121295&query_hl=24&itool=pubmed_DocSum

I should perhaps clarify my comment though. I was referring
specifically to neonatal and infants - i.e. children who are not yet on
solid foods. After that all bets are off. And once kids pass the major
series of vaccinations, environmental mercury becomes the dominant source.

And, of course, there are exceptions. I included one or two papers
about some of these in the links above. Basically, people in
contaminated areas, or who live on high-fish diets break this trend.

Bryan
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Jason
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1119

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

In article <-pqdnZRmTrWOMSnZnZ2dnUVZ8sydnZ2d@bt.com>, "john"
<sc@nospam.com> wrote:

As a pediatrician, who has been in practice for over two decades, I find it
more than a little insulting as well as disturbing to have someone say that
these children were always there. ..... For years the vaccine division at
the CDC and others have said the reason for the dramatic increase in autism
is due to "better diagnosing" and "greater awareness." They have encouraged
those like Paul Shattuck to manufacture uncertainty. .... There are no
studies that have found the previously undiagnosed or misdiagnosed autistic
individuals among older Americans. They simply aren't there. We need to
address the real reason for the alarming autism rate. No more secrets or
truth-spinning. This is not a faux epidemiological epidemic, nor an
infectious epidemic, nor a genetic epidemic (as there are no genetic
epidemics). That leaves an epidemic linked to some sort of exposure.
[Schafer Autism Report--Pediatrics article May 2006] The Obfuscation of The
Iatrogenic Autism Epidemic

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

John,
Thanks for your post. Thanks also for your concern for children. I do
believe (but have NO proof) that there were autistic children during those
years before we had any vaccines. Let's assume that mercury is the cause
of autism. If that is true, it means that some of those children (that
lived in ancient times) would have developed autism if they were exposed
to mercury. Since there were NO vaccines containing mercury in those
days--the rates of autism would have been lower in those days. The type of
mercury in fish (methylmercury) is even more dangerous than the type of
mercury in thimerosal.
Jason
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Jason
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1119

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

In article <44b4a20c$0$2016$ba620dc5@text.nova.planet.nl>, JohnDoe
<none@ofyourbusiness.com> wrote:

Jason Johnson wrote:

Quote:
In article <1152673893.879215.63560@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
"cathyb" <cathybeesley@optusnet.com.au> wrote:

Jeff wrote:
"cathyb" <cathybeesley@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:1152666687.958216.148380@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
(...)

You wouldn't think so. Furthermore, Jason seems to have been saying
that since there is so much mercury from other sources, one wouldn't
expect the rates of autism in the population to decrease on the removal
of thimerosal from vaccines even if the mercury/autism theory were fact
instead of unsupported theory.

Which is to say that it is an insignificant factor in mercury exposure,
at least until major factors have been removed. If thimerosal makes *no
difference* to autism rates, then the benefits of using the
preservative outweigh the disadvantages (which appear to be none) in
that situation.

Don't get me wrong. The tiny bit of mercury in vaccines has never
been shown
to do any harm at the doses used. In the US and other developed countries,
it seems like it would be a lot better if all forms of mercury were
removed
from the vaccines. Other preservatives can be used, and there is a
theoretical risk of having mercury in vaccines. Clearly, the
benefits of the
vaccine with thimerasol clearly outweigh the tiny risks of the vaccines,
but, I think vaccines would be a bit safer if they didn't have mercury in
them.

So, personally, I would prefer that mercury were removed from all
vaccines.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


All other things being equal, why not? And, of course, it more or less
has been. It seems, however, that the anti-vac crowd just move on to
finding another reason to try and deny kids vaccination. MMR/autism,
MMR/SIDS. The lack of evidence doesn't bother them, but the worry with
all the scaremongering is rates of vaccination. And that's a worry for
the vaccinated and unvaccinated alike.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Cathy,
I am not part of the anti-vac crowd. I hope that the anti-vac crowd does NOT
deny kids vaccinations.

But they do.

Quote:
If so, they would lose lots of members.

No, they won't. They oppose vaccines which have never and vaccines that
no longer contain any mercury in any form whatsoever. They want vaccines
banned, period. There is a reason why these people are referred to as
insane.

Quote:
I hope they evolve into the anti-dental fillings crowd.
I hope they succeed in removing mercury from dental fillings.

I don't think they will. They couldn't care less about mercury in any
form from any source. They're agenda is to have vaccines banned. The
thimerosal-autism scare is only a means to an end for them, nothing
more. Just look at their resistance against the cervical cancer vaccine
- there it's 'promoting sexual promiscuity'. Or look at the Yurko case -
there vaccines were said to cause shaken baby syndrome.

Quote:
Once they win that battle, the next battle will be much more difficult
--keeping fish from becoming contaminated with mercury.

At least you seem sincere about removing any possible exposure to
mercury from all sources. And not just mercury, all other heavy metals.
Which makes you an order of magnitude more honest than the anti-vac crowd.

Quote:
I can only hope so since my agenda is protecting children from mercury and
other heavy metals. I am in favor of vaccines and would prefer they do not
contain mercury. Even Jeff seems to believe that it would be a good thing
if mercury was removed from vaccines.

But not (as far as I can tell) because he sees a thimerosal-autism link,
but to err on the side of caution. And maybe to remove an argument from
the arsenal of the anti-vac crowd.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hello,
I was not aware that the anti-vac crowd is trying to ban vaccines.
Vaccines have saved the lives of millions of people. I am NOT a part of
that crowd and would NEVER be a member of that crowd. They are insane if
they want to ban vaccines.
I guess that means they will not be trying to ban mercury from dental
fillings and to prevent fish from becoming comtaminated with mercury. How
sad. Thanks for your post.
Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Jason
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1119

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

In article <zW5tg.7614$cd3.1426@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>, "Jeff"
<kidsdoc2000@hotmail.com> wrote:

"JohnDoe" <none@ofyourbusiness.com> wrote in message
news:44b4a20c$0$2016$ba620dc5@text.nova.planet.nl...
(...)

Quote:
No, they won't. They oppose vaccines which have never and vaccines that no
longer contain any mercury in any form whatsoever. They want vaccines
banned, period. There is a reason why these people are referred to as
insane.

I don't think they are insane. Misled, certainly. But not insane.

People don't necessarily think logically about some things. Medicine and
vaccines are clearly two areas where people don't think logically.

Quote:
I hope they evolve into the anti-dental fillings crowd. I hope they
succeed in removing mercury from dental fillings.

I don't think they will. They couldn't care less about mercury in any form
from any source. They're agenda is to have vaccines banned. The
thimerosal-autism scare is only a means to an end for them, nothing more.
Just look at their resistance against the cervical cancer vaccine - there
it's 'promoting sexual promiscuity'. Or look at the Yurko case - there
vaccines were said to cause shaken baby syndrome.

This points to an inability to examine evidence and think.

Jeff

Quote:
Once they win that battle, the next battle will be much more difficult
--keeping fish from becoming contaminated with mercury.

At least you seem sincere about removing any possible exposure to mercury
from all sources. And not just mercury, all other heavy metals. Which
makes you an order of magnitude more honest than the anti-vac crowd.

I can only hope so since my agenda is protecting children from mercury
and
other heavy metals. I am in favor of vaccines and would prefer they do
not
contain mercury. Even Jeff seems to believe that it would be a good thing
if mercury was removed from vaccines.

But not (as far as I can tell) because he sees a thimerosal-autism link,
but to err on the side of caution. And maybe to remove an argument from
the arsenal of the anti-vac crowd.

Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Jeff,
Good points. Regardless of whether they are insane or misled, I would
never become a member of that movement if they want to ban vaccines.
Vaccines have saved the lives of millions of people. Thanks for your post.
Let's err on the side of caution.
Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Mark Probert
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 01 May 2005
Posts: 1720

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

Jason Johnson wrote:
Quote:
In article <-pqdnZRmTrWOMSnZnZ2dnUVZ8sydnZ2d@bt.com>, "john"
sc@nospam.com> wrote:

As a pediatrician, who has been in practice for over two decades, I find it
more than a little insulting as well as disturbing to have someone say that
these children were always there. ..... For years the vaccine division at
the CDC and others have said the reason for the dramatic increase in autism
is due to "better diagnosing" and "greater awareness." They have encouraged
those like Paul Shattuck to manufacture uncertainty. .... There are no
studies that have found the previously undiagnosed or misdiagnosed autistic
individuals among older Americans. They simply aren't there. We need to
address the real reason for the alarming autism rate. No more secrets or
truth-spinning. This is not a faux epidemiological epidemic, nor an
infectious epidemic, nor a genetic epidemic (as there are no genetic
epidemics). That leaves an epidemic linked to some sort of exposure.
[Schafer Autism Report--Pediatrics article May 2006] The Obfuscation of The
Iatrogenic Autism Epidemic

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

John,
Thanks for your post. Thanks also for your concern for children.

If you believe that, you are a moron.


I do
Quote:
believe (but have NO proof) that there were autistic children during those
years before we had any vaccines. Let's assume that mercury is the cause
of autism. If that is true, it means that some of those children (that
lived in ancient times) would have developed autism if they were exposed
to mercury. Since there were NO vaccines containing mercury in those
days--the rates of autism would have been lower in those days. The type of
mercury in fish (methylmercury) is even more dangerous than the type of
mercury in thimerosal.
Jason
Back to top
HCN
medicine forum Guru Wannabe


Joined: 15 May 2005
Posts: 139

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b50523$0$29084$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...
Quote:

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:59ednfF2Utr9zCnZnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com...

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b418a2$0$23438$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:OYWdnWNYOJuIcS7ZnZ2dnUVZ_u-dnZ2d@comcast.com...

"john" <sc@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:zKadnfSe_YVzey7ZnZ2dnUVZ8smdnZ2d@bt.com...
this is one of the main lies to hide the vaccine
connection.http://www.whale.to/a/autism_diagnosis.html

"So the first lie to remember today is this: autism is ancient. It's
not ancient, it's new." ------Mark Blaxill, MBA



So havind a Masters in Business Administration makes him an expert in
the history of neurology?



History of neurology?

No one needs to know a thing about neurology to recognize or be around
the autistic.

That is, unless you are inferring that autism is secretive disease that
a Doctor must "discover" and thus treat.


Wow... you are as much an expert as someone with an MBA!


Just as everyone here thought. You don't even know what an autistic is or
the symptoms.

I have known more autistic folks than you can count (assuming you have at
least 10 fingers)


Quote:
Keep it up, pharma toad, you support John more and more.

I can see it now. You fall and break your arm. Someone comes along an
comments that your arm is broken and offers help. You response is, "What
the hell do you know, you're just a store clerk"


If you were the store clerk (and I suspect that you are), I would definitely
say "STAY AWAY!!!"... I would not want someone of your less than common
sense and intellectual buffoonery moving a broken limb.

Some selected reading material for you (and yes, I have read them all):
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0307275655/
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1582344787/
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0679756973
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0684853949/
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0688172172/
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0131486861/
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0201483378/
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0385501285/
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0099450259

I have also never claimed to be anything but an aerospace engineer.
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vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 8:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:3NednZOhItRbzijZnZ2dnUVZ_o6dnZ2d@comcast.com...
Quote:

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b50523$0$29084$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:59ednfF2Utr9zCnZnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com...

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b418a2$0$23438$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:OYWdnWNYOJuIcS7ZnZ2dnUVZ_u-dnZ2d@comcast.com...

"john" <sc@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:zKadnfSe_YVzey7ZnZ2dnUVZ8smdnZ2d@bt.com...
this is one of the main lies to hide the vaccine
connection.http://www.whale.to/a/autism_diagnosis.html

"So the first lie to remember today is this: autism is ancient. It's
not ancient, it's new." ------Mark Blaxill, MBA



So havind a Masters in Business Administration makes him an expert in
the history of neurology?



History of neurology?

No one needs to know a thing about neurology to recognize or be around
the autistic.

That is, unless you are inferring that autism is secretive disease that
a Doctor must "discover" and thus treat.


Wow... you are as much an expert as someone with an MBA!


Just as everyone here thought. You don't even know what an autistic is
or the symptoms.

I have known more autistic folks than you can count (assuming you have at
least 10 fingers)


Keep it up, pharma toad, you support John more and more.

I can see it now. You fall and break your arm. Someone comes along an
comments that your arm is broken and offers help. You response is, "What
the hell do you know, you're just a store clerk"


If you were the store clerk (and I suspect that you are), I would
definitely say "STAY AWAY!!!"... I would not want someone of your less
than common sense and intellectual buffoonery moving a broken limb.


I have also never claimed to be anything but an aerospace engineer.

So, nothing logical.

Aerospace Engineer doesn't say anything except the ability to get through a
specialized engineering regimin. Of course that's nothing to sneeze at.
I hired and fired a lot in your regimin as an engineering manager and
director. Of course that has nothing to do with anything here, as I have
been trying to point out.

I am NOT weighing in on the arguments of the "causes" of autism. I just
know that it is far more prevalent now than ever before in history. I am
not speaking of total numbers, which would be obvious, but percentage of
population and especially a "healthy" population.

REASONS (things that are different now than 50 to 150 years ago)

1. MUCH more sugar in young diets
2. less vegetables in young diets
3. Vaccinations of all types.
4. Women are skinnier at child birth and actually try to prevent the
"normal" two to three times the babies weight gain.
5. Less breast feeding (This could possibly be the milk or the holding for
prolonged periods)
6. Less dietary "C".
7. Less sunlight
8. Hydrocarbons in the air

Some are a real strech, but none-the-less differences.

Personnaly, I would put 1, 4, 5 at the top of the list.
Why? There are many other maladies resultant.

Any "engineer" can make a "statistical" case for any of the above.
REAL doctors or medical community would be separating historic and
individualistic data, rather than off the top yes or no or defending their
practice of using or not insisting a certain regimin.


Quote:

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vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 8:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:3NednZOhItRbzijZnZ2dnUVZ_o6dnZ2d@comcast.com...
Quote:

Keep it up, pharma toad, you support John more and more.

I can see it now. You fall and break your arm. Someone comes along an
comments that your arm is broken and offers help. You response is, "What
the hell do you know, you're just a store clerk"


If you were the store clerk (and I suspect that you are), I would
definitely say "STAY AWAY!!!"... I would not want someone of your less
than common sense and intellectual buffoonery moving a broken limb.



Your reading ability matches that of many engineers who end up with dumb
contracts as representatives of a company.
You guys made me a LOT of money getting companies that I worked for out of
trouble by FIRST reviewing the contract before the signing.

I didn't even imply touching you much less your arm.

If allowed, I would call for help and see if you wanted to immobilize the
arm with pillows.
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Jason
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1119

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 9:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

In article <44b55d63$0$29191$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com>, "vernon"
<there@there> wrote:

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:3NednZOhItRbzijZnZ2dnUVZ_o6dnZ2d@comcast.com...
Quote:

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b50523$0$29084$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:59ednfF2Utr9zCnZnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com...

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b418a2$0$23438$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:OYWdnWNYOJuIcS7ZnZ2dnUVZ_u-dnZ2d@comcast.com...

"john" <sc@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:zKadnfSe_YVzey7ZnZ2dnUVZ8smdnZ2d@bt.com...
this is one of the main lies to hide the vaccine
connection.http://www.whale.to/a/autism_diagnosis.html

"So the first lie to remember today is this: autism is ancient. It's
not ancient, it's new." ------Mark Blaxill, MBA



So havind a Masters in Business Administration makes him an expert in
the history of neurology?



History of neurology?

No one needs to know a thing about neurology to recognize or be around
the autistic.

That is, unless you are inferring that autism is secretive disease that
a Doctor must "discover" and thus treat.


Wow... you are as much an expert as someone with an MBA!


Just as everyone here thought. You don't even know what an autistic is
or the symptoms.

I have known more autistic folks than you can count (assuming you have at
least 10 fingers)


Keep it up, pharma toad, you support John more and more.

I can see it now. You fall and break your arm. Someone comes along an
comments that your arm is broken and offers help. You response is, "What
the hell do you know, you're just a store clerk"


If you were the store clerk (and I suspect that you are), I would
definitely say "STAY AWAY!!!"... I would not want someone of your less
than common sense and intellectual buffoonery moving a broken limb.


I have also never claimed to be anything but an aerospace engineer.

So, nothing logical.

Aerospace Engineer doesn't say anything except the ability to get through a
specialized engineering regimin. Of course that's nothing to sneeze at.
I hired and fired a lot in your regimin as an engineering manager and
director. Of course that has nothing to do with anything here, as I have
been trying to point out.

I am NOT weighing in on the arguments of the "causes" of autism. I just
know that it is far more prevalent now than ever before in history. I am
not speaking of total numbers, which would be obvious, but percentage of
population and especially a "healthy" population.

REASONS (things that are different now than 50 to 150 years ago)

1. MUCH more sugar in young diets
2. less vegetables in young diets
3. Vaccinations of all types.
4. Women are skinnier at child birth and actually try to prevent the
"normal" two to three times the babies weight gain.
5. Less breast feeding (This could possibly be the milk or the holding for
prolonged periods)
6. Less dietary "C".
7. Less sunlight
8. Hydrocarbons in the air

Some are a real strech, but none-the-less differences.

Personnaly, I would put 1, 4, 5 at the top of the list.
Why? There are many other maladies resultant.

Any "engineer" can make a "statistical" case for any of the above.
REAL doctors or medical community would be separating historic and
individualistic data, rather than off the top yes or no or defending their
practice of using or not insisting a certain regimin.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hello,
You left out such things such as the higher levels of "heavy metals" in
our environment. For example, fish in many rivers and lakes have high
levels of methylmercury which is the most dangerous type of mercury. I
believe that
number 8 should be at the top of your list.
Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Back to top
vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 9:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

"Jason Johnson" <jason@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:jason-1207061418440001@66-52-22-23.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net...
Quote:
In article <44b55d63$0$29191$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com>, "vernon"
there@there> wrote:

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:3NednZOhItRbzijZnZ2dnUVZ_o6dnZ2d@comcast.com...

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b50523$0$29084$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:59ednfF2Utr9zCnZnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com...

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b418a2$0$23438$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:OYWdnWNYOJuIcS7ZnZ2dnUVZ_u-dnZ2d@comcast.com...

"john" <sc@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:zKadnfSe_YVzey7ZnZ2dnUVZ8smdnZ2d@bt.com...
this is one of the main lies to hide the vaccine
connection.http://www.whale.to/a/autism_diagnosis.html

"So the first lie to remember today is this: autism is ancient.
It's
not ancient, it's new." ------Mark Blaxill, MBA



So havind a Masters in Business Administration makes him an expert
in
the history of neurology?



History of neurology?

No one needs to know a thing about neurology to recognize or be
around
the autistic.

That is, unless you are inferring that autism is secretive disease
that
a Doctor must "discover" and thus treat.


Wow... you are as much an expert as someone with an MBA!


Just as everyone here thought. You don't even know what an autistic is
or the symptoms.

I have known more autistic folks than you can count (assuming you have
at
least 10 fingers)


Keep it up, pharma toad, you support John more and more.

I can see it now. You fall and break your arm. Someone comes along an
comments that your arm is broken and offers help. You response is,
"What
the hell do you know, you're just a store clerk"


If you were the store clerk (and I suspect that you are), I would
definitely say "STAY AWAY!!!"... I would not want someone of your less
than common sense and intellectual buffoonery moving a broken limb.


I have also never claimed to be anything but an aerospace engineer.

So, nothing logical.

Aerospace Engineer doesn't say anything except the ability to get through
a
specialized engineering regimin. Of course that's nothing to sneeze at.
I hired and fired a lot in your regimin as an engineering manager and
director. Of course that has nothing to do with anything here, as I have
been trying to point out.

I am NOT weighing in on the arguments of the "causes" of autism. I just
know that it is far more prevalent now than ever before in history. I am
not speaking of total numbers, which would be obvious, but percentage of
population and especially a "healthy" population.

REASONS (things that are different now than 50 to 150 years ago)

1. MUCH more sugar in young diets
2. less vegetables in young diets
3. Vaccinations of all types.
4. Women are skinnier at child birth and actually try to prevent the
"normal" two to three times the babies weight gain.
5. Less breast feeding (This could possibly be the milk or the holding for
prolonged periods)
6. Less dietary "C".
7. Less sunlight
8. Hydrocarbons in the air

Some are a real strech, but none-the-less differences.

Personnaly, I would put 1, 4, 5 at the top of the list.
Why? There are many other maladies resultant.

Any "engineer" can make a "statistical" case for any of the above.
REAL doctors or medical community would be separating historic and
individualistic data, rather than off the top yes or no or defending their
practice of using or not insisting a certain regimin.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hello,
You left out such things such as the higher levels of "heavy metals" in
our environment. For example, fish in many rivers and lakes have high
levels of methylmercury which is the most dangerous type of mercury. I
believe that
number 8 should be at the top of your list.
Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"possibly" and mercury from a million sources.
The main reason I question it involvement is that people breathed MUCH
higher levels of smoke, carbon monoxide and particle hydrocarbons 60 years
ago.

"Fish" are a minor source and have many neurological benefits from Omega 3
and certain amino acids.
I also forgot aluminum from aluminum cookware (mother or child)
Back to top
Jason
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 1119

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Autism: It's not ancient, it's new. Reply with quote

In article <44b56a39$0$29106$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com>, "vernon"
<there@there> wrote:

"Jason Johnson" <jason@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:jason-1207061418440001@66-52-22-23.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net...
Quote:
In article <44b55d63$0$29191$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com>, "vernon"
there@there> wrote:

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:3NednZOhItRbzijZnZ2dnUVZ_o6dnZ2d@comcast.com...

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b50523$0$29084$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:59ednfF2Utr9zCnZnZ2dnUVZ_qadnZ2d@comcast.com...

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44b418a2$0$23438$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"HCN" <hcn@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:OYWdnWNYOJuIcS7ZnZ2dnUVZ_u-dnZ2d@comcast.com...

"john" <sc@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:zKadnfSe_YVzey7ZnZ2dnUVZ8smdnZ2d@bt.com...
this is one of the main lies to hide the vaccine
connection.http://www.whale.to/a/autism_diagnosis.html

"So the first lie to remember today is this: autism is ancient.
It's
not ancient, it's new." ------Mark Blaxill, MBA



So havind a Masters in Business Administration makes him an expert
in
the history of neurology?



History of neurology?

No one needs to know a thing about neurology to recognize or be
around
the autistic.

That is, unless you are inferring that autism is secretive disease
that
a Doctor must "discover" and thus treat.


Wow... you are as much an expert as someone with an MBA!


Just as everyone here thought. You don't even know what an autistic is
or the symptoms.

I have known more autistic folks than you can count (assuming you have
at
least 10 fingers)


Keep it up, pharma toad, you support John more and more.

I can see it now. You fall and break your arm. Someone comes along an
comments that your arm is broken and offers help. You response is,
"What
the hell do you know, you're just a store clerk"


If you were the store clerk (and I suspect that you are), I would
definitely say "STAY AWAY!!!"... I would not want someone of your less
than common sense and intellectual buffoonery moving a broken limb.


I have also never claimed to be anything but an aerospace engineer.

So, nothing logical.

Aerospace Engineer doesn't say anything except the ability to get through
a
specialized engineering regimin. Of course that's nothing to sneeze at.
I hired and fired a lot in your regimin as an engineering manager and
director. Of course that has nothing to do with anything here, as I have
been trying to point out.

I am NOT weighing in on the arguments of the "causes" of autism. I just
know that it is far more prevalent now than ever before in history. I am
not speaking of total numbers, which would be obvious, but percentage of
population and especially a "healthy" population.

REASONS (things that are different now than 50 to 150 years ago)

1. MUCH more sugar in young diets
2. less vegetables in young diets
3. Vaccinations of all types.
4. Women are skinnier at child birth and actually try to prevent the
"normal" two to three times the babies weight gain.
5. Less breast feeding (This could possibly be the milk or the holding for
prolonged periods)
6. Less dietary "C".
7. Less sunlight
8. Hydrocarbons in the air

Some are a real strech, but none-the-less differences.

Personnaly, I would put 1, 4, 5 at the top of the list.
Why? There are many other maladies resultant.

Any "engineer" can make a "statistical" case for any of the above.
REAL doctors or medical community would be separating historic and
individualistic data, rather than off the top yes or no or defending their
practice of using or not insisting a certain regimin.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hello,
You left out such things such as the higher levels of "heavy metals" in
our environment. For example, fish in many rivers and lakes have high
levels of methylmercury which is the most dangerous type of mercury. I
believe that
number 8 should be at the top of your list.
Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"possibly" and mercury from a million sources.
The main reason I question it involvement is that people breathed MUCH
higher levels of smoke, carbon monoxide and particle hydrocarbons 60 years
ago.

"Fish" are a minor source and have many neurological benefits from Omega 3
and certain amino acids.
I also forgot aluminum from aluminum cookware (mother or child)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hello,
Good points--I also forgot cookware. My memory is perfect but recall
reading stories in magazines and newspaper about the high levels of
mercury found in fish. In some cities, they do not allow people to fish in
those rivers due to the dangerous levels of mercury found in those fish.
You may have heard about the mercury catastrophe in Minamata Bay, Japan.
People ingested methylmercury
contaminated fish. It led to neurologic defects. Pregnant women are
advised by doctors to not eat fish.
Jason
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Back to top
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