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Ph Balancing
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Steph
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 504

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 2:42 am    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing Reply with quote

"synchronicity" <psych1@enlightenment-psych.net> wrote in message
news:1152204549.507182.198150@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
Quote:
A good friend of mine developed cancer some years back, when he told me
he was understandably depressed needless to say. I told him lots of
people get cancer,

True...........

Quote:
it has to do with Acid/Alkaline balances in your
body.

Bollox of the highest order

Quote:
YOu can beat it if you try. He said he would like to know what to
do about it.


Surgery? Radiotherapy? Chemotherapy?

Quote:
I told him about diets and green tea, and garden fresh vegatbles (he
has a garden), and lottsa stuff. That was around five years ago, he
called me a month ago right after his last test.The doctor told him he
is in remission. I asked if he was still drinking plenty of tea and to
what do you attribute this accomplishment.


Well, I guess we would need to know what cancer, what stage, and what
treatment.........

Quote:
He said that he paid $45 dollars for a book that basically told him the
same thing that I told him.


That's nice.

Quote:
At the time I didn't know that there were other things to maintain this
all important acid/alkaline Ph balance. It's something that I
recommended to a young lady yesterday, her son has cancer and she is
just learning about Ph factors.


Your body maintains it's pH balance very well thankyou.

Quote:
This is the Ph balancer
http://www.myforevergreen.org/mindfood/Catalog/PersonalWords.html

Look into FrequenSea, watch the video
http://www.frequensea.com/mindfood/Product/Page2.html
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Jeff
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1313

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 4:40 am    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing Reply with quote

"synchronicity" <psych1@enlightenment-psych.net> wrote in message
news:1152204549.507182.198150@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
Quote:
A good friend of mine developed cancer some years back, when he told me
he was understandably depressed needless to say. I told him lots of
people get cancer, it has to do with Acid/Alkaline balances in your
body.

Actually, it has to do with genes in your cells and damage to the genes. It
has nothing to do with acid base balance.
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Matti Narkia
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Posts: 425

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 1:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing Reply with quote

On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 02:42:02 GMT, "Steph" <steph@vancouvers.island>
wrote:
Quote:

"synchronicity" <psych1@enlightenment-psych.net> wrote in message
news:1152204549.507182.198150@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
A good friend of mine developed cancer some years back, when he told me
he was understandably depressed needless to say. I told him lots of
people get cancer,

True...........

it has to do with Acid/Alkaline balances in your
body.

Bollox of the highest order

I agree. Cancer cells intracellular pH is usually acidic, but that has

nothing to do with pH of blood. When cancerous tumor grows,
it becomes very dense and its blood supply and hence oxygen supply
suffers. Therefore cancer cells have to at least partly resort to
anaerobic metabolism, which causes production of lactic acid, which
lowers the pH of cancer cells. Thus the low pH of cancer cells may be
the result of cancer cells crowding one another, and not of mild
chronic metabolic acidosis. Some evidence about this:

ScienceDaily: Attacking Cancer's Sweet Tooth Is Effective Strategy
Against Tumors
<http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/06/060630094933.htm>

"As a tumor grows, cells crowd one another and may be cut off
from oxygen-carrying blood vessels--a distinct disadvantage
since most cells require oxygen to produce the bulk of their
energy-storing adenosine triphosphate (ATP). In the 1920s, Otto
Warburg proposed that some cancer cells evolved the ability to
switch over to an ancient, oxygen-free route, the glycolytic
pathway. What is more, they continue to use this pathway even
when access to oxygen is restored. Though the so-called Warburg
effect has since been confirmed, the role played by glycolysis
in cancer has been largely ignored. Few have attempted to
attack specific points along the glycolytic pathway to gain a
therapeutic effect."

Fantin VR, St-Pierre J, Leder P.
Attenuation of LDH-A expression uncovers a link between glycolysis,
mitochondrial physiology, and tumor maintenance.
Cancer Cell. 2006 Jun;9(6):425-34.
PMID: 16766262 [PubMed - in process]
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=abstractplus&list_uids=16766262>

Bui T, Thompson CB.
Cancer's sweet tooth.
Cancer Cell. 2006 Jun;9(6):419-20.
PMID: 16766260 [PubMed - in process]
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=abstractplus&list_uids=16766260>

Ristow M.
Oxidative metabolism in cancer growth.
Curr Opin Clin Nutr Metab Care. 2006 Jul;9(4):339-45.
PMID: 16778561 [PubMed - in process]
process]<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=abstractplus&list_uids=16778561>

Glycolysis
<http://web.indstate.edu/thcme/mwking/glycolysis.html>

"Oxidation of glucose is known as glycolysis.Glucose is
oxidized to either lactate or pyruvate. Under aerobic
conditions, the dominant product in most tissues is pyruvate
and the pathway is known as aerobic glycolysis. When oxygen is
depleted, as for instance during prolonged vigorous exercise,
the dominant glycolytic product in many tissues is lactate and
the process is known as anaerobic glycolysis."

Walenta S, Schroeder T, Mueller-Klieser W.
Lactate in solid malignant tumors: potential basis of a metabolic
classification in clinical oncology.
Curr Med Chem. 2004 Aug;11(16):2195-204. Review.
PMID: 15279558 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=abstractplus&list_uids=15279558>

"A number of studies have demonstrated that malignant
transformation is associated with an increase in glycolytic flux
and in anaerobic and aerobic cellular lactate excretion. ..

[...]

... In all tumor entities investigated, high molar
concentrations of lactate were correlated with a high incidence
of distant metastasis already in an early stage of the disease.
Low lactate tumors (< median of approx. 8 micromol/g) were
associated with both a longer overall and disease free survival
compared to high lactate lesions (lactate > approx. 8
micromol/g). ..."

Walenta S, Mueller-Klieser WF.
Lactate: mirror and motor of tumor malignancy.
Semin Radiat Oncol. 2004 Jul;14(3):267-74. Review.
PMID: 15254870 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=abstractplus&list_uids=15254870>

On the other hand the following studies suggest that production of
lactic acid is not the only cause of tumor acidity:

De Milito A, Fais S.
Tumor acidity, chemoresistance and proton pump inhibitors.
Future Oncol. 2005 Dec;1(6):779-86.
PMID: 16556057 [PubMed - in process]
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=abstractplus&list_uids=16556057>

"... The extracellular pH of solid tumors is significantly more
acidic than that of normal tissues, thus impairing the uptake
of weakly basic chemotherapeutic drugs and reducing their
effect on tumors. An important determinant of tumor acidity is
the anaerobic metabolism that allows selection of cells able to
survive in an hypoxic-anoxic environment with the generation of
lactate. However, this is not the major mechanism responsible
for the development of an acidic environment within solid
tumors. It appears clear that a complex framework of protein-
protein, protein-lipid and lipid-lipid interactions underlay
the pH homeostasis in mammalian cells. Malignant tumor cells
seem to hijack some of these mechanism to protect themselves
from the acidic environment and to maintain acidity in an
environment unsuitable for normal or more differentiated
cells. ..."

Newell K, Franchi A, Pouyssegur J, Tannock I.
Studies with glycolysis-deficient cells suggest that production of
lactic acid is not the only cause of tumor acidity.
Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. 1993 Feb 1;90(3):1127-31.
PMID: 8430084 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
<http://www.pubmedcentral.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&pubmedid=8430084>
<http://www.pnas.org/cgi/reprint/90/3/1127>

"... These results provide evidence that the production of lactic
acid via glycolysis is not the only mechanism responsible for the
development of an acidic environment within solid tumors."
Quote:

[snip]

At the time I didn't know that there were other things to maintain this
all important acid/alkaline Ph balance. It's something that I
recommended to a young lady yesterday, her son has cancer and she is
just learning about Ph factors.

Your body maintains it's pH balance very well thankyou.

True. Still, There are two different pHs to be considered:

extracellular (blood and other extracellular fluids) and
intracellular.

The pH of the blood is tightly regulated. The normal pH of the human
arterial blood is 7.40. In the venous blood it is slightly lower
because of the higher concentration of the carbon dioxide.
Intracellular pH values are lower than those of the extracellular
fluid and range from 6.8 to 7.3 depending on the tissue and
its metabolic rate. When arterial pH is below 7.40, the state is
called acidosis and when above it, it is called alkalosis.

Acidosis and alkalosis are both classified as either metabolic or
respiratory, depending on whether it is bicarbonate (HCO3-)
(metabolic) or carbon dioxide (pCO2) (respiratory) that primarily
deviates from the normal range in blood. In metabolic acidosis HCO3-
and thus plasma pH (hydrogen concentration) fall, in alkalosis they
rise. In respiratory alkalosis pCO2 value and thus the carbonic acid
concentration falls and pH rises and vice versa in respiratory
acidosis.

The most common imbalance in the acid-base balance in the
industrialized countries is mild chronic metabolic acidosis caused
by the diet rich in the animal protein. Proteins are metabolized to
organic acids. The typical American diet produces after metabolism
approximately 100 meq of acid every day. This kind of a diet has been
proved to cause aciduria and calciuria as a consequence of acidosis
and thus a loss of total calcium of the body. Cola drinks that contain
phosphoric acid are another acidosis-inducing ingredient of diet,
especially among young people

In addition to the protein-rich diet, mild acute or chronic
metabolic acidosis has been reported in connection with diarrhoea
(loss of bicarbonate), fasting (ketoacids) and heavy exercise.
Strenous exercise, like all states causing tissue hypoxia, elevates
the amount of the lactic acid in the extracellular fluids.

Chronic metabolic acidosis is known to cause muscle protein breakdown.
It may also increase the risk of osteoporosis. Supplements
like potassium bicarbonate (KHCO3) neutralize metabolic acidosis and
may prevent continuing age-related loss of muscle mass and restore
previously accrued deficits. Mineral supplements such as magnesium,
calcium and potassium and most vegetables also help to neutralize mild
acidosis.

But as I mentioned, earlier mild chronic metabolic acidosis probably
has nothing to do with intracellular pH of cancer cells.



--
Matti Narkia
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Matti Narkia
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Posts: 425

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 11:17 am    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing Reply with quote

On 6 Jul 2006 09:49:09 -0700, "synchronicity"
<psych1@enlightenment-psych.net> wrote:

Quote:
A good friend of mine developed cancer some years back, when he told me
he was understandably depressed needless to say. I told him lots of
people get cancer, it has to do with Acid/Alkaline balances in your
body. YOu can beat it if you try. He said he would like to know what to
do about it.

I told him about diets and green tea, and garden fresh vegatbles (he
has a garden), and lottsa stuff. That was around five years ago, he
called me a month ago right after his last test.The doctor told him he
is in remission. I asked if he was still drinking plenty of tea and to
what do you attribute this accomplishment.

He said that he paid $45 dollars for a book that basically told him the
same thing that I told him.

At the time I didn't know that there were other things to maintain this
all important acid/alkaline Ph balance. It's something that I
recommended to a young lady yesterday, her son has cancer and she is
just learning about Ph factors.

This is the Ph balancer
http://www.myforevergreen.org/mindfood/Catalog/PersonalWords.html

Look into FrequenSea, watch the video
http://www.frequensea.com/mindfood/Product/Page2.html

Seems that you are just another lousy spammer. Shame on you. Don't you
know that spamming always backfires. I _never_ buy spammed products
and I urge others also to boycott products and the company mentioned
in above links.



--
Matti Narkia
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J W
medicine forum beginner


Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

You know Steph, I don't post in here much because I have and want to
keep a positive attitude and hold out hope for a remission or cure of my
cancer. I do read many of the posts in here though and I must say that
despite the fact you are helpful and informative in some areas, you are
a very negative person. It almost seems to me at times that you go out
of your way to bum out anyone that posts in here.

When I first started posting in here I was under the impression that you
were some sort of doctor or at least authority on the subject of cancer.
Well if you are I'm thankful that I have never had the honor of an
office visit with you. Almost every post I ever made in here you came
along and dashed my hopes right into the gutter. Why don't you lighten
up sme man.

If someone comes in here with an idea or suggestion, leave them alone as
long as they aren't selling snake oil. Proven fact that some things do
work well for some and at same time not well for others, but one of the
few ways people can find alternative ideas for help is to read them in
groups like this and decide for themselves whether or not to try them.
They don't need self appointed gaurdians shooting down every idea or
suggestion that comes in here. That's why a lot of people who have good
ideas never tell anyone about them because of people like you shooting
them down and embarrassing them. Who are you to decide what is or is not
right for people to try? facts are clear that the chemo and radiation
alone are effecrtive in only about 3% of patients. There are a lot of
complimentary alternatives including mental and spiritual attitudes that
do in many cases improve the outcome of one's illness.

Bottom line if someone comes here with a thought or idea let the
majority decide if it is something that they are willing to try or not
and keep your thoughts to yourself unless you have physically tried
them. History is riddled with dumb sounding ideas that went on to become
very useful ideas because intelligent people encourage free thinking and
new ideas. Ignorant people oppose anything that isn't tried and true
tested, even if it has been proven to be extremely costly and shown
only limited success. In otherwords if you aint got something good to
say, don't speak because people who are very ill with this disease do
not need negativity.



Re: Ph Balancing

Group: sci.med.diseases.cancer Date: Fri, Jul 7, 2006, 2:42am (EDT+4)
From: steph@vancouvers.island (Steph)
"synchronicity" <psych1@enlightenment-psych.net> wrote in message
news:1152204549.507182.198150@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
A good friend of mine developed cancer some years back, when he told me
he was understandably depressed needless to say. I told him lots of
people get cancer,
True...........
it has to do with Acid/Alkaline balances in your body.
Bollox of the highest order
YOu can beat it if you try. He said he would like to know what to do
about it.
Surgery? Radiotherapy? Chemotherapy?
I told him about diets and green tea, and garden fresh vegatbles (he has
a garden), and lottsa stuff. That was around five years ago, he called
me a month ago right after his last test.The doctor told him he is in
remission. I asked if he was still drinking plenty of tea and to what do
you attribute this accomplishment.
Well, I guess we would need to know what cancer, what stage, and what
treatment.........
He said that he paid $45 dollars for a book that basically told him the
same thing that I told him.
That's nice.
At the time I didn't know that there were other things to maintain this
all important acid/alkaline Ph balance. It's something that I
recommended to a young lady yesterday, her son has cancer and she is
just learning about Ph factors.
Your body maintains it's pH balance very well thankyou.
This is the Ph balancer
http://www.myforevergreen.org/mindfood/Catalog/PersonalWords.html
Look into FrequenSea, watch the video
http://www.frequensea.com/mindfood/Product/Page2.html
Back to top
Steph
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 504

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:2968-44AFB9A0-25@storefull-3251.bay.webtv.net...
Quote:
You know Steph, I don't post in here much because I have and want to
keep a positive attitude and hold out hope for a remission or cure of my
cancer. I do read many of the posts in here though and I must say that
despite the fact you are helpful and informative in some areas, you are
a very negative person. It almost seems to me at times that you go out
of your way to bum out anyone that posts in here.


Only anyone who posts misleading or untrue nonsense, especially if they are
out to make money from the desperate.

Quote:
When I first started posting in here I was under the impression that you
were some sort of doctor or at least authority on the subject of cancer.
Well if you are I'm thankful that I have never had the honor of an
office visit with you. Almost every post I ever made in here you came
along and dashed my hopes right into the gutter. Why don't you lighten
up sme man.


That's fine. My patients prefer honesty to fairy-tales, but it doesn't work
for everyone.

Quote:
If someone comes in here with an idea or suggestion, leave them alone as
long as they aren't selling snake oil. Proven fact that some things do
work well for some and at same time not well for others, but one of the
few ways people can find alternative ideas for help is to read them in
groups like this and decide for themselves whether or not to try them.
They don't need self appointed gaurdians shooting down every idea or
suggestion that comes in here. That's why a lot of people who have good
ideas never tell anyone about them because of people like you shooting
them down and embarrassing them. Who are you to decide what is or is not
right for people to try? facts are clear that the chemo and radiation
alone are effecrtive in only about 3% of patients. There are a lot of
complimentary alternatives including mental and spiritual attitudes that
do in many cases improve the outcome of one's illness.


Your figures are wrong. About 65% of patients with cancer are cured by
surgery, radiation and chemotherapy. More if you include non-melanoma askin
cancer. I have no idea where your 3% comes from.
I hva eno problem at all with "complimentary alternatives including mental
and spiritual attitudes", however, anyone who claims that they improve
outcomes neeeds to provide the hard evidence. I don't claim things without
evidence, and I expect the same of others.

Quote:
Bottom line if someone comes here with a thought or idea let the
majority decide if it is something that they are willing to try or not
and keep your thoughts to yourself unless you have physically tried
them. History is riddled with dumb sounding ideas that went on to become
very useful ideas because intelligent people encourage free thinking and
new ideas. Ignorant people oppose anything that isn't tried and true
tested, even if it has been proven to be extremely costly and shown
only limited success. In otherwords if you aint got something good to
say, don't speak because people who are very ill with this disease do
not need negativity.


One man's negativity is another man's honesty. People in the end do what
they want, and believe what they want. I have no control over that. But I do
have a right (responsibility even) to point out folly when I see it.
Sorry if you find that alarming.

I totally reject the concept that if I don't have anything good to say about
a subject, I should say nothing. Someone said that all that is required for
evil to succeed is that good men do nothing. I reject doing nothing. As for
"ignorant" people opposing anything which isn't tried and true tested, I
believe those ignorant people are the intelligent ones. People who grasp at
straws in desperate circumstances are understandable. People who throw or
sell straws to drowning men are despicable.

If you find that unpalatable, so be it
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J W
medicine forum beginner


Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 5:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing Reply with quote

Actually you are quite wrong. Excessive sugar consumption among other
things can and does throw your gut's PH off which can cause yeast
overgrowth as well as candida yeast overgrowth which causes your immune
system to suffer greatly as 40% of your body's imune system is in your
gut and I think it's common knowledge that a comprimised immune system
cannot effectively destroy mutated body cells which we all get numerous
times during our lives.
Whle some people have a genetic prepensity to certain types of cancer,
cancer is not for the most part caused by defective genes.

Our bodies replicate spent cells constantly 24/7 at a blinding pace.
Inevitably there will be errors ( cancerous or mutated cells) everyone
gets them. Our immune system under normal circumstances finds and
destroys them before they can replicate and become a serious problem

When the immune system can't fight them effectively they then can
multiply quickly and next thing you know, you have a tumor. allergies
can also comprimise your immune system and cause the same problem. So
yes keeping your body's PH balanced, keeping allergies in check and
doing whatever you can to strengthen your immune system is extremely
important in fighting against cancer. Know what you are talking about
before you open yer yap. Read the book "fighting cancer with nutrition"
By Patrick Quillen it is written by a PHD 20 year head of nutrition
depts. at national cancer institutes who has helped many patient recover
or at least have better outcomes with thier cancers. I think he knows
what he's talking about and he backs up every statement with facts and
references.


Re: Ph Balancing

Group: sci.med.diseases.cancer Date: Fri, Jul 7, 2006, 4:40am (EDT+4)
From: kidsdoc2000@hotmail.com (Jeff)
"synchronicity" <psych1@enlightenment-psych.net> wrote in message
news:1152204549.507182.198150@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
A good friend of mine developed cancer some years back, when he told me
he was understandably depressed needless to say. I told him lots of
people get cancer, it has to do with Acid/Alkaline balances in your
body.
Actually, it has to do with genes in your cells and damage to the genes.
It has nothing to do with acid base balance.
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MohsMD
medicine forum beginner


Joined: 08 Jul 2006
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 7:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

I am going to back Steph up on this one -- the thought that consuming
too much sugars causing a pH imbalance which leads to immunosuppression
and subsequent cancer formation/progression is not even on the radar
screen of things that are likely.

Some of this probably represents good science being twisted or
misunderstood -- the increase in glycosylation end products which is
being referred to does have many deleterious effects, most notably on
the cardiovascular system, but has never been implicated in cancerous
change or progression to my knowledge in a reputable journal.
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J W
medicine forum beginner


Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 8:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

Candida and Fungal Infections Related To Cancer Development Some doctors
theorize that candida or other systemic fungal infections may cause or
at least contribute to the development of cancer. It makes sense. A
widespread candida infection plays havoc on the immune system. Not only
does the immune system become overwhelmed and worn out from fighting it,
but the candida (or other pathogens) excrete toxins that further weaken
and harm the body.
The major waste product of candida is acetaldehyde, which produces
ethanol. Ethanol can cause excessive fatigue, and reduces strength and
stamina. In addition, it destroys enzymes needed for cell energy, and
causes the release of free radicals that can damage DNA. Ethanol makes
it difficult to absorb iron. This reduces one of the most important
oxygen supports in the blood (iron), and makes it difficult for your
body to oxygenate fully. And you know what may happen when your body
can't oxygenate well. So it may be important to deal with candida if one
wants to successfully recover from cancer. There is a simple test to
help you determine if you have candida overgrowth.
First thing in the morning, before you put ANYTHING in your mouth, get a
clear glass of water. Better still; leave it by your bed the night
before. Work up a bit of saliva, and then spit it into the glass of
water.
Check the water every 15 minutes or so for up to one hour. If you have a
candida yeast infection, you will see strings (like legs) traveling down
into the water from the saliva floating on the top, or "cloudy" saliva
will sink to the bottom of the glass, or cloudy specks will seem to be
suspended in the water. If nothing develops in 30 minutes, you are
probably candida yeast free.
A few reports implicate the role of fungi in causing leukemia. In 1999
Meinolf Karthaus, MD, watched three different children with leukemia
suddenly go into remission upon receiving a triple antifungal drug
cocktail for their "secondary" fungal infections. In 1997 Mark Bielski
stated that leukemia, whether acute or chronic, is intimately associated
with the yeast, Candida albicans, which mutates into a fungal form when
it overgrows.
Milton White, MD. believed that cancer is a chronic, infectious, fungus
disease. He was able to find fungal spores in every sample of cancer
tissue he studied.
Author Doug Kaufmann asserts that fungi in foods may play a role in
cancer. He has seen children become free of their documented leukemia
once the child's parents simply changed the child's diet. Kaufmann's
diet is base on the widely published problem of mycotoxin contamination
of our grain foods.
Grains such as corn, wheat, barley, sorghum, and other foods such as
peanuts, are commonly contaminated with cancer-causing fungal poisons
called mycotoxins. One of them, called aflatoxin, just happens to be the
most carcinogenic substance on earth.
He says we consume, on average, from 0.15mg to 0.5mg of aflatoxin per
day. So it is not sugar alone that is the problem in our western diet,
but fungal toxins that are found in the sugary grains. More than once
has Kaufmann interviewed a caller (on his health talk show) who
absolutely craved peanut butter and popcorn just prior to their
diagnosis of cancer.
Kaufmann feels that antibiotics may play a role in this. Antibiotics
destroy the normal, protective gut bacteria, allowing intestinal yeast
and fungi to grow unchecked. Resulting in Candida overgrowth. This can
lead to immune suppression, symptoms of any autoimmune disease, or even
cancer.
"If the onset of any symptom or disease, cancer included, was preceded
by a course of antibiotics," he says, "then look for a fungus to be at
the root of your problem.
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pmoran@bordernet.com.au
medicine forum beginner


Joined: 28 May 2006
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 11:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:2968-44AFB9A0-25@storefull-3251.bay.webtv.net...
Quote:
You know Steph, I don't post in here much because I have and want to
keep a positive attitude and hold out hope for a remission or cure of my
cancer. I do read many of the posts in here though and I must say that
despite the fact you are helpful and informative in some areas, you are
a very negative person. It almost seems to me at times that you go out
of your way to bum out anyone that posts in here.

When I first started posting in here I was under the impression that you
were some sort of doctor or at least authority on the subject of cancer.
Well if you are I'm thankful that I have never had the honor of an
office visit with you. Almost every post I ever made in here you came
along and dashed my hopes right into the gutter. Why don't you lighten
up sme man.

If someone comes in here with an idea or suggestion, leave them alone as
long as they aren't selling snake oil. Proven fact that some things do
work well for some and at same time not well for others, but one of the
few ways people can find alternative ideas for help is to read them in
groups like this and decide for themselves whether or not to try them.
They don't need self appointed gaurdians shooting down every idea or
suggestion that comes in here. That's why a lot of people who have good
ideas never tell anyone about them because of people like you shooting
them down and embarrassing them. Who are you to decide what is or is not
right for people to try? facts are clear that the chemo and radiation
alone are effecrtive in only about 3% of patients. There are a lot of
complimentary alternatives including mental and spiritual attitudes that
do in many cases improve the outcome of one's illness.

Bottom line if someone comes here with a thought or idea let the
majority decide if it is something that they are willing to try or not
and keep your thoughts to yourself unless you have physically tried
them. History is riddled with dumb sounding ideas that went on to become
very useful ideas because intelligent people encourage free thinking and
new ideas. Ignorant people oppose anything that isn't tried and true
tested, even if it has been proven to be extremely costly and shown
only limited success. In otherwords if you aint got something good to
say, don't speak because people who are very ill with this disease do
not need negativity.

I hear you well. Steph can be very blunt, and it is true that we cannot
always predict how cancer will behave.

The problem is that trying to avoid ALL negativity also inhibits the
forthright discussion needed to get at the truth of things. The truth is
pretty important where claims of cancer cure are concerned.

I am sure you find it difficult to appreciate it right now, but it is in
the best interests of ALL cancer sufferers that we should be tough on those
who irresponsibly promote unsubstantiated and unlikely methods like pH
balancing, if only to try and force them into producing some decent
evidence for their claims. I say this in full knowledge of how highly,
and regularly, pH balancing is currently spoken of in alternative circles.

And, contrary to what you say, our disbelief is not based simply on the
fact that certain methods like pH balancing are implausible on very
well-trodden paths of science. There is also not a trace of evidence they
work -- not even any decent anecdotal evidence (e.g. testimonial) in this
particular instance (I know, I am looking at this stuff all the time).
There is usually also no sound provenance for them, with usually a
distinctly entrepreneurial flavour to their birth..

We can't prove absolutely that such methods don't have any benefits for
cancer patients, but we can explain why that is staggeringly unlikely, and
also point to a solid track record of them not working whenever they are
more closely examined, despite often extravagant claims.

Peter Moran

www.cancerwatcher.com
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Steph
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 504

PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 12:49 am    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:7957-44B01948-93@storefull-3256.bay.webtv.net...
<Candida and Fungal Infections Related To Cancer Development Some doctors
<theorize that candida or other systemic fungal infections may cause or
<at least contribute to the development of cancer. It makes sense. A
<widespread candida infection plays havoc on the immune system. Not only
<does the immune system become overwhelmed and worn out from fighting it,
<but the candida (or other pathogens) excrete toxins that further weaken
<and harm the body.

Candida gets a ho;d when immunity is already compromised, not the other way
around. You have the cart before the horse.
As for your spit frolics..............enjoy
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madiba
medicine forum Guru Wannabe


Joined: 05 Jul 2005
Posts: 203

PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 1:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

Peter Moran <pmoran@bordernet.com.au> wrote:

Quote:
"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:2968-44AFB9A0-25@storefull-3251.bay.webtv.net...

Bottom line if someone comes here with a thought or idea let the
majority decide if it is something that they are willing to try or not
and keep your thoughts to yourself unless you have physically tried
them. History is riddled with dumb sounding ideas that went on to become
very useful ideas because intelligent people encourage free thinking and
new ideas. Ignorant people oppose anything that isn't tried and true
tested, even if it has been proven to be extremely costly and shown
only limited success. In otherwords if you aint got something good to
say, don't speak because people who are very ill with this disease do
not need negativity.
Its very simple. If you have an idea about an alternative method of

treating cancer put it in an alt.cancer newsgroup.
If and when your idea works verifiably, put it in this NG.

Quote:
I hear you well. Steph can be very blunt, and it is true that we cannot
He's perceptibly more upbeat after a holiday though.. :-/

But why not? Why should the patient and the doc* not take this unique
chance that usenet offers to lay the cards on the table as they really
are? Straight talk, without frills, especially for snake oil salesmen.
Few docs can afford to do that in a practice nowdays for fear of scaring
the patients away. Here things are cosy and anonymous, so give it all
you've got. No tissues to dry up the tears though, so if its sympathy
one's looking for then go to a support group or to a doctors practice.


Quote:
always predict how cancer will behave.
The problem is that trying to avoid ALL negativity also inhibits the
forthright discussion needed to get at the truth of things. The truth is
pretty important where claims of cancer cure are concerned.
I am sure you find it difficult to appreciate it right now, but it is in
the best interests of ALL cancer sufferers that we should be tough on those
who irresponsibly promote unsubstantiated and unlikely methods like pH
balancing, if only to try and force them into producing some decent
evidence for their claims. I say this in full knowledge of how highly,
and regularly, pH balancing is currently spoken of in alternative circles.
Then they are discussions that fail to acknowledge basic principles of

(patho)-physiology. Sure some tumors can become hypoxic and thus
acidic, but this is because of rapid cell division and not the other way
round, ie the tumor didnt form because of the acidic environment.
Thats something else I've noticed: a lot of the alt. claims contain SOME
truth, often gleaned out of context from bona fide sources. This makes
it twice as difficult for the untrained person to decide whether he s
being taken for a ride or not. A tip as you mentioned is to see if
products are being pushed.
--
madiba
*theoretically of course: here on usenet patients are not treated,
people w. questions are advised.
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Jeff
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1313

PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 11:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing Reply with quote

"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:19261-44AFE691-262@storefull-3254.bay.webtv.net...
Quote:
Actually you are quite wrong. Excessive sugar consumption among other
things can and does throw your gut's PH off which can cause yeast
overgrowth as well as candida yeast overgrowth which causes your immune
system to suffer greatly as 40% of your body's imune system is in your
gut and I think it's common knowledge that a comprimised immune system
cannot effectively destroy mutated body cells which we all get numerous
times during our lives.

The whole yeast thing is crap:

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/candida.html

Besides, we have these neat things called "kidneys" that maintain the body's
pH in the proper balance.

Quote:
Whle some people have a genetic prepensity to certain types of cancer,
cancer is not for the most part caused by defective genes.

Our bodies replicate spent cells constantly 24/7 at a blinding pace.
Inevitably there will be errors ( cancerous or mutated cells) everyone
gets them. Our immune system under normal circumstances finds and
destroys them before they can replicate and become a serious problem

When the immune system can't fight them effectively they then can
multiply quickly and next thing you know, you have a tumor. allergies
can also comprimise your immune system and cause the same problem.

Really? Where is the evidence that people who have allergies are more likely
to get cancer?

Quote:
So
yes keeping your body's PH balanced, keeping allergies in check and
doing whatever you can to strengthen your immune system is extremely
important in fighting against cancer.

Bull. My kidneys keep my pH in perfect balance. And autoimmune diseases are
caused by an immune system that is overreacting.

Quote:
Know what you are talking about
before you open yer yap. Read the book "fighting cancer with nutrition"
By Patrick Quillen it is written by a PHD 20 year head of nutrition
depts. at national cancer institutes who has helped many patient recover
or at least have better outcomes with thier cancers. I think he knows
what he's talking about and he backs up every statement with facts and
references.

What you think means little to me.

Jeff

Quote:
Re: Ph Balancing

Group: sci.med.diseases.cancer Date: Fri, Jul 7, 2006, 4:40am (EDT+4)
From: kidsdoc2000@hotmail.com (Jeff)
"synchronicity" <psych1@enlightenment-psych.net> wrote in message
news:1152204549.507182.198150@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
A good friend of mine developed cancer some years back, when he told me
he was understandably depressed needless to say. I told him lots of
people get cancer, it has to do with Acid/Alkaline balances in your
body.
Actually, it has to do with genes in your cells and damage to the genes.
It has nothing to do with acid base balance.



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Jeff
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 1313

PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 11:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

The problem with the study is that there are very few widespread fungal
infections. In fact, the only one I saw was in a patient who was on
chemotherapy. As soon as his immune system started to come back to normal,
he beat the candida infection.

Jeff

"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:7957-44B01948-93@storefull-3256.bay.webtv.net...
Candida and Fungal Infections Related To Cancer Development Some doctors
theorize that candida or other systemic fungal infections may cause or
at least contribute to the development of cancer. It makes sense. A
widespread candida infection plays havoc on the immune system. Not only
does the immune system become overwhelmed and worn out from fighting it,
but the candida (or other pathogens) excrete toxins that further weaken
and harm the body.
The major waste product of candida is acetaldehyde, which produces
ethanol. Ethanol can cause excessive fatigue, and reduces strength and
stamina. In addition, it destroys enzymes needed for cell energy, and
causes the release of free radicals that can damage DNA. Ethanol makes
it difficult to absorb iron. This reduces one of the most important
oxygen supports in the blood (iron), and makes it difficult for your
body to oxygenate fully. And you know what may happen when your body
can't oxygenate well. So it may be important to deal with candida if one
wants to successfully recover from cancer. There is a simple test to
help you determine if you have candida overgrowth.
First thing in the morning, before you put ANYTHING in your mouth, get a
clear glass of water. Better still; leave it by your bed the night
before. Work up a bit of saliva, and then spit it into the glass of
water.
Check the water every 15 minutes or so for up to one hour. If you have a
candida yeast infection, you will see strings (like legs) traveling down
into the water from the saliva floating on the top, or "cloudy" saliva
will sink to the bottom of the glass, or cloudy specks will seem to be
suspended in the water. If nothing develops in 30 minutes, you are
probably candida yeast free.
A few reports implicate the role of fungi in causing leukemia. In 1999
Meinolf Karthaus, MD, watched three different children with leukemia
suddenly go into remission upon receiving a triple antifungal drug
cocktail for their "secondary" fungal infections. In 1997 Mark Bielski
stated that leukemia, whether acute or chronic, is intimately associated
with the yeast, Candida albicans, which mutates into a fungal form when
it overgrows.
Milton White, MD. believed that cancer is a chronic, infectious, fungus
disease. He was able to find fungal spores in every sample of cancer
tissue he studied.
Author Doug Kaufmann asserts that fungi in foods may play a role in
cancer. He has seen children become free of their documented leukemia
once the child's parents simply changed the child's diet. Kaufmann's
diet is base on the widely published problem of mycotoxin contamination
of our grain foods.
Grains such as corn, wheat, barley, sorghum, and other foods such as
peanuts, are commonly contaminated with cancer-causing fungal poisons
called mycotoxins. One of them, called aflatoxin, just happens to be the
most carcinogenic substance on earth.
He says we consume, on average, from 0.15mg to 0.5mg of aflatoxin per
day. So it is not sugar alone that is the problem in our western diet,
but fungal toxins that are found in the sugary grains. More than once
has Kaufmann interviewed a caller (on his health talk show) who
absolutely craved peanut butter and popcorn just prior to their
diagnosis of cancer.
Kaufmann feels that antibiotics may play a role in this. Antibiotics
destroy the normal, protective gut bacteria, allowing intestinal yeast
and fungi to grow unchecked. Resulting in Candida overgrowth. This can
lead to immune suppression, symptoms of any autoimmune disease, or even
cancer.
"If the onset of any symptom or disease, cancer included, was preceded
by a course of antibiotics," he says, "then look for a fungus to be at
the root of your problem.
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J
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 29 Apr 2005
Posts: 612

PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 12:05 am    Post subject: Re: Ph Balancing (steph) Reply with quote

madiba wrote:

Quote:
Peter Moran <pmoran@bordernet.com.au> wrote:

"J W" <jonboy42@webtv.net> wrote in message


Bottom line if someone comes here with a thought or idea let the
majority decide if it is something that they are willing to try or not
and keep your thoughts to yourself unless you have physically tried
them. History is riddled with dumb sounding ideas that went on to become
very useful ideas because intelligent people encourage free thinking and
new ideas. Ignorant people oppose anything that isn't tried and true
tested, even if it has been proven to be extremely costly and shown
only limited success. In otherwords if you aint got something good to
say, don't speak because people who are very ill with this disease do
not need negativity.
Its very simple. If you have an idea about an alternative method of
treating cancer put it in an alt.cancer newsgroup.
If and when your idea works verifiably, put it in this NG.

No thanks, he'll get the same answers, from me, Steph and many others.
J
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