FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups 
 ProfileProfile   PreferencesPreferences   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
Forum index » Medicine forums » nursing
Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 2 of 5 [61 Posts] View previous topic :: View next topic
Goto page:  Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5 Next
Author Message
\"Jan Drew\"
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 02 Mar 2006
Posts: 353

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 3:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152196477.258789.90420@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
Quote:

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Mark Thorson wrote:
On the other hand, he also attacked coffee,
white sugar, white flour, meat, and spicy
foods.

He attacked alcohol, coffee, and tea. I would say despite the
so-called benefits of green tea any product that contains caffeine will
be bad for your health. Caffeine has a number of negative health
effects, including but not limited to making you chronically anxious.

So?


He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

Spicy foods do not cause IBS. Spicy foods will aggravate an existing
IBS situation. The cause of IBS inmost cases is grains, specifically
wheat with gluten. He was not correct on this point. He was dead wrong
in advocating human consumption of excessive amounts of grains. Get
this thru your thick neaderthal skull. KELLOGG WAS WRONG ABOUT THE
CAUSES AND THE TREATMENT OF IBS.


And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

He advocated vegetarianism, which is WRONG. Humans need animal sourced
foods to achieve even a modicum of good health.

Wrong. You are eating seconded handed what you need.
Quote:


Would you ever eat disease ridden pigs raised by some fool in his back
yard and then slaughtered in totally unsanitary conditions? I
certainly would not. That would be a sure fire way to end up with IBS,
just like Kellogg warned.

1) I am not aware of anyone who would advocate eating diseased animals
or animals processed in unsanitary conditions. D'uh!
2) The real surefire way to get IBS is to eat Kelloggs manufactured and
process wheat and corn grains.


He advocated therapies that today have no place
in medicine, such as phototherapy, fresh air
therapy, etc. Probably the worst legacy of
his influence is the practice of colon cleansing.
He didn't invent it, but he was its strongest
advocate in the U.S. during the last part of the
19th century and the first part of the 20th
century.

That is a total misrepresentation of Kellogg's actual position on the
use of enemas.

Wrong. He wrote a frikkin' book on the subject and he prescribed enemas
for hundreds of "patients" and when they did not work, he surgically
removed part of their bowels.

Quit trying to change history.


See, the above hyperlink in another post of mine on this thread.

Further rules #55 and 58 of Kellogg's rules for Biologic Living clearly
state that enemas can be used to treat two different health conditions:
Constipation and bilious conditions or IBS. Both of these conditions
are abnormal.

And he equated virtually all maladies (health abnormailties) to lower
GI sources which in almost every case would lead to having to clean the
source of the "autointoxication" which would mean a colonic enema.


Despite this common misrepresentation of the facts, Kellogg NEVER ever
recommended that a NORMAL person eating the recommended diet of natural
foods would even need to take even one enema.

Except that virtually all health complaints turned normal people into
patients who needed his enemas. And his dietary recomendations of bland
grains would be a cause of IBS and other GI complaints. If they weren't
sick to begin with, his diet would cause enough problems to label them
as sick and needing an enema.


Who says so? I do.

And that is the crux. You say so, but you are an abject idiot.

TC
Back to top
TC
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 1814

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 3:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

Jan Drew wrote:
Quote:
"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152196477.258789.90420@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Mark Thorson wrote:
On the other hand, he also attacked coffee,
white sugar, white flour, meat, and spicy
foods.

He attacked alcohol, coffee, and tea. I would say despite the
so-called benefits of green tea any product that contains caffeine will
be bad for your health. Caffeine has a number of negative health
effects, including but not limited to making you chronically anxious.

So?


He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

Spicy foods do not cause IBS. Spicy foods will aggravate an existing
IBS situation. The cause of IBS inmost cases is grains, specifically
wheat with gluten. He was not correct on this point. He was dead wrong
in advocating human consumption of excessive amounts of grains. Get
this thru your thick neaderthal skull. KELLOGG WAS WRONG ABOUT THE
CAUSES AND THE TREATMENT OF IBS.


And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

He advocated vegetarianism, which is WRONG. Humans need animal sourced
foods to achieve even a modicum of good health.

Wrong. You are eating seconded handed what you need.

You cannot get all the nutrients you need in the optimal forms and the
optimal amounts from plants alone.

TC

Quote:


Would you ever eat disease ridden pigs raised by some fool in his back
yard and then slaughtered in totally unsanitary conditions? I
certainly would not. That would be a sure fire way to end up with IBS,
just like Kellogg warned.

1) I am not aware of anyone who would advocate eating diseased animals
or animals processed in unsanitary conditions. D'uh!
2) The real surefire way to get IBS is to eat Kelloggs manufactured and
process wheat and corn grains.


He advocated therapies that today have no place
in medicine, such as phototherapy, fresh air
therapy, etc. Probably the worst legacy of
his influence is the practice of colon cleansing.
He didn't invent it, but he was its strongest
advocate in the U.S. during the last part of the
19th century and the first part of the 20th
century.

That is a total misrepresentation of Kellogg's actual position on the
use of enemas.

Wrong. He wrote a frikkin' book on the subject and he prescribed enemas
for hundreds of "patients" and when they did not work, he surgically
removed part of their bowels.

Quit trying to change history.


See, the above hyperlink in another post of mine on this thread.

Further rules #55 and 58 of Kellogg's rules for Biologic Living clearly
state that enemas can be used to treat two different health conditions:
Constipation and bilious conditions or IBS. Both of these conditions
are abnormal.

And he equated virtually all maladies (health abnormailties) to lower
GI sources which in almost every case would lead to having to clean the
source of the "autointoxication" which would mean a colonic enema.


Despite this common misrepresentation of the facts, Kellogg NEVER ever
recommended that a NORMAL person eating the recommended diet of natural
foods would even need to take even one enema.

Except that virtually all health complaints turned normal people into
patients who needed his enemas. And his dietary recomendations of bland
grains would be a cause of IBS and other GI complaints. If they weren't
sick to begin with, his diet would cause enough problems to label them
as sick and needing an enema.


Who says so? I do.

And that is the crux. You say so, but you are an abject idiot.

TC
Back to top
Mark Thorson
medicine forum addict


Joined: 16 May 2005
Posts: 80

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 7:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

"Mr. Natural-Health" wrote:
Quote:

He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

No, he was against spicy foods for everybody.
I have _The_New_Cookery_ which is based on the
foods served at the San, and none of the recipes
are spicy. The spiciest recipe is creamed onions,
in which several changes of the boiling water are
used to remove the sharpness of the onions.

Quote:
And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

Nope, he strongly advocated ovo-lacto vegetarianism.
Not one recipe in the book had meat in it.

Quote:
Would you ever eat disease ridden pigs raised by some fool in his back
yard and then slaughtered in totally unsanitary conditions? I
certainly would not. That would be a sure fire way to end up with IBS,
just like Kellogg warned.

He advocated therapies that today have no place
in medicine, such as phototherapy, fresh air
therapy, etc. Probably the worst legacy of
his influence is the practice of colon cleansing.
He didn't invent it, but he was its strongest
advocate in the U.S. during the last part of the
19th century and the first part of the 20th
century.

That is a total misrepresentation of Kellogg's actual position
on the use of enemas.

No, it's not. Enemas were commonly given at the San.

Quote:
See, the above hyperlink in another post of mine on this thread.

Further rules #55 and 58 of Kellogg's rules for Biologic Living clearly
state that enemas can be used to treat two different health conditions:
Constipation and bilious conditions or IBS. Both of these conditions
are abnormal.

That's not the same as saying enemas are restricted
to these conditions.

Quote:
Despite this common misrepresentation of the facts, Kellogg NEVER ever
recommended that a NORMAL person eating the recommended diet of natural
foods would even need to take even one enema.

Who says so? I do.

Why should anybody accept your pronouncements
just because you say so? You have a long history
of being an unreliable source of information.
Back to top
vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 8:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

You were way to kind about a real idiot and his clod Mr. Natural-Health.

Humans are omnivores.

91 is not old for someone who is "supposedly" in great health. A sane
person with his background would probably have made it to 104 or more.


"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152023331.636828.191220@75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Quote:
http://naturalhealthperspective.com/tutorials/john-kellogg.html

John Harvey "Kellogg was a dynamo of human energy, a personification of
the work ethic, who needed only 4 to 5 hours of sleep a night, went
cycling or jogging every morning, dictated 25 to 50 letters a day,
adopted and reared 42 children, wrote nearly 50 books, edited a major
magazine, performed more than 22,000 operations, gave virtually all of
his money to charitable organizations, loved human service, generally
accomplished the work of ten active people, and lived in good health to
age 91."[2]

Kellogg is the most overlooked pioneer in the Wellness movement that
makes Weston Price look like a mere child in comparison.

Absolutely hilarious. I could not have written a funnier piece if I
tried. And the funniest thing is that the author wrote this in all
seriousness. Really.

Since the author is so completely clued out about how funny and
perverse the whole piece is, I will quote the author and add a few
comments along the way.

********

John Harvey Kellogg (February 26, 1852 - December 14, 1943)
physician, surgeon, a great showmen, health food promoter, and inventor
was a larger than life character in the wellness movement.

comment: How can this man have any professional credibility as a
physician and surgeon if he dabbles in any form of showmanship and food
promotion? Either you are a doctor or you are a promoter and a
showmanship, you cannot be both.

"Kellogg was a dynamo of human energy, a personification of the work
ethic, who needed only 4 to 5 hours of sleep a night,

**
comment: so what? who cares? How bright was he if he failed to grasp
the simple concept of getting proper rest?
**

went cycling or jogging every morning, dictated 25 to 50 letters a
day,

**
comment: pretty impressive. dictation is so exhausting.
**

adopted and reared 42 children, wrote nearly 50 books, edited a major
magazine,

**
quacks are usually known as prolific writers, they have to get their
nonsense out in a public arena somehow, and what "major" magazine was
this?
**

performed more than 22,000 operations, gave virtually all of his money
to charitable organizations, loved human service, generally
accomplished the work of ten active people, and lived in good health to
age 91."[2]

**
"accomplished the work of ten active people" eh? Are you sure it wasn't
ten active people? or maybe eleven active people? I guess we can round
it ot ten, it sound so much better than twelve point three five two
active people. We'll use ten.
**

John was born into a large devout Seventh-day Adventist family in
Tyrone. And, moved four years later in 1856 to Battle Creek, Michigan.
Adventists were strict vegetarians who believed in following Genesis
literally. He would soon embraced his religion's approach to healthy
living.

**
So his "scientific" beliefs actually came from a fundamental religious
belief system. Thought so.
**

After having worked for James and Ellen White, two of the founding
members of the Adventist Church, as a teenager he was selected by them
to become a real physician in order to give legitimacy to their views
on health.

**
He was selected to, and he elected to, become a "real" physician, not
to heal the world, but to give legitimacy to their views. Which means
that before he became a "real" physician, their "views" had little or
no legitimacy. And somehow his becoming a "real" physician in order to
give their views legitimacy was supposed to give them legitimacy.
Methinks he hath failed. And this is the beginning of medical frauds
posing as doctors to further the interests of radical fringe groups
and/or the food industry. That is quite the proud legacy this man has
left the world.
**

He initially studied medicine at the Hygeio-Therapeutic College, run by
Russell T. Trall. Then at the Michigan State Normal School (since 1959,
Eastern Michigan University). And finally graduated from the New York
University Medical College at Bellevue Hospital in 1875 with a degree
in medicine. His graduation thesis, "What is Disease?," clearly
reflected the natural hygiene beliefs of Russell Trall.

**
Two apparently legit colleges and one quake factory, and he adheres to
the quack factory beliefs for his theses. Talk about agenda driven
cultists.
**

Before graduating he started editing the Adventist's Health Reformer
newsletter in 1872, which had been operating since 1866. Upon
graduating from medical school, Kellogg begain working at the
Adventist's Health Reform Institute in Battle Creek, Michigan. He
became the superintendent of it in 1876 when he was only 24 years old.
And, immediately renamed it the Battle Creek Sanitarium (Sans) because
it was a place where people could learn how to stay well. Under his
direction, the Sans soon became a luxurious amusement center for the
rich and famous to visit. He, also, took over editorial control of the
Health Reformer and renamed it the Good Health magazine.

In 1890 Dr. Kellogg organized the Battle Creek Sanitarium Food Company.
And, the Sanitas Food Company in 1898.

In 1902 he rebuilt the Sans after it was completely destroyed by fire.

"In 1907, after protracted conflict, Dr. Kellogg broke his ties of
fifty years with the Adventist church; he retained control of the
Sanitarium and health food factory. The Sanitarium was in its heyday
from 1915-1930, but business was hurt by the Great Depression and it
went into receivership in 1933."[2]

**
Profit, the real motivation. That is so selfless of Kellogg to pursue
riches in spite of his religious beliefs.
**

The list of Kellogg's accomplishments seemingly can go on forever. He
was an accomplished surgeon and a member of many different medical
associations, including the AMA. He invented a number of instruments
and devices which he got 30 patents for, including the electric
blanket, the electric light bath and the universal dynamometer for
testing the strength of the muscles. Founded the American Medical
Missionary College and the Battle Creek College. Organized a School of
Home Economics as well as a School of Physical Education. And, made
seven trips abroad to further his medical education.

**
OMG, he was a member of the AMA. he must be legit. Bwah Ha ha .....
**

Who was John Harvey Kellogg?
Kellogg called his system of health biologic living. His health program
consisted principally of a grain-based vegetarian diet. Kellogg, also,
strongly opposed alcohol, tobacco, caffeine, sugar, condiments and
spices. Biologic living also advocated exercise, hydrotherapy, fresh
air and sunshine, good posture and dress. It had an unmistakable
connection to natural health due to its belief that lifestyle can
affect your longevity. And, because of Kellogg's marketing of health
foods. According to Kellogg the benefits of biologic living were
"health, comfort, efficiency, long life" and "good digestion, sound
sleep, a clear head, a placid mind, content and joy to be alive."[3]
Which largely parallels natural health's interest in the mind and in
stress reduction.

**
He also ranted against any sexual activity whatsoever except for the
sole purpose of procreation. He also ranted against any and all
enjoyable or stimulating activities whatsoever. He was also a sexual
deviant who obviously failed to follow his own advice.
**

Kellogg claimed to be a scientific physician who advocated scientific
feeding with an unwavering belief in the power of whole grain foods.
But, much of his ideas on biologic living were based upon the writings
of Seventh-day Adventist prophet Ellen White, who reportedly got her
inspirations from over 2,000 visions with god. Nevertheless, Kellogg
also strongly believed in conducting experiments.

**
Very well said... he "claimed" to be a scientific physician, when all
he was was a self promoter, a grain salesman, a religious zealot, and a
medical quack.
**

John Harvey Kellogg's list of health foods developed and marketed
included Granola (1877 a mixture of oatmeal and corn meal, baked into
biscuits, then ground to bits), peanut butter (1892), Granose (1894 a
flaked-wheat cereal), corn flakes (1897), caramel cereal coffee, and
Bulgarian yogurt. In addition, Kellogg developed America's first meat
analogs, and meat substitutes Protose and Nuttose, as well as the first
acidophilus soymilk

**
snake oil salesman, was he? That is what I've been telling you. These
products were not sold for health, they were sold as alleged health for
PROFIT.
**

Kellogg' Less Memorable Ideas
Kellogg, also, managed to achieved notoriety for his views on sex,
autointoxication which he believe was the source of most illness, his
use of a daily enema regimine at the Sans, and for his interests in
eugenics.

**
He had an anal fixation. He was a sexual deviant.
**

Authored Over 50 Books - Many of which are still in print.
1877 Plain facts for old and young - This book is often used to justify
totally ignoring Kellogg's place in history for his views on the evils
of sex. But, the book does manage to conclude with two chapters on
health related topics: General Health Hints and Quotes on Health.
1887 First Book in Physiology and Hygiene- Presents the laws of
healthful living, and the subjects of physiology, and hygiene to young
children.
1897 Pork or The Dangers of Pork-Eating Exposed, Booklet
19?? The Simple Life in a Nutshell - Booklet on 60 rules for Biologic
Living.
1903 Rational Hydrotherapy
1910 Light Therapeutics
1922 Autointoxication or Intestinal Toxemia
1916 Neurasthenia or Nervous Exhaustion, 2 pages
1922 Tobaccoism, or How Tobacco Kills - Kellogg's exposť on the
dangers of smoking tobacco was reprinted inAm J Public Health. 2002
Jun;92(6):932-4.
1923 Battle Creek Sanitarium Health Ladder, Columbia Records - A set of
five 78 rpm phonograph records that promoted a series of twenty
physical exercises that was accompanied with a 50 page booklet. Music
was used as a means to reduce the boredom of the physical exercises.
1927 The New Dietetics
1928 Habits in Relation to Longevity, 15 pages
1929 Art of Massage
1930 The Biologic Life: Rules for "Right Living," 30 pages
1932 How to have good health: Through biologic living
Organizations that are carrying on the work started by John Harvey
Kellogg
Lifestyle Laboratory - A web site that at least talks abut the health
principles of Biologic Living.
References
John Harvey Kellogg, M.D., by Richard W. Schwarz, Andrews University
Press, Berrien Springs, MI, 1981.
William Shurtleff and Akiko Aoyagi, Dr. John Harvey Kellogg and Battle
Creek Foods: Work with Soy, Unpublished Manuscript
John Harvey Kellogg, The Simple Life in a Nutshell, 19??.

********

The man was a greeday bastard, and he was one of the first to
successfully sell crap as real food to unsuspecting ill people who
trusted him as a trained physician. He was a fraud from day one and his
memory shouild be kept alive so that people today can learn to
recognize quacks and frauds in the food and health industry.

TC
Back to top
vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 8:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

Adventists are a cult and advance non- healthful systems and have written
their own bible.

Humans, including Jesus are / were omnivores.
Back to top
vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 8:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

"Jan Drew" <jdrew1374@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Gnarg.116454$H71.99698@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
Quote:

"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152196477.258789.90420@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Mark Thorson wrote:
On the other hand, he also attacked coffee,
white sugar, white flour, meat, and spicy
foods.

He attacked alcohol, coffee, and tea. I would say despite the
so-called benefits of green tea any product that contains caffeine will
be bad for your health. Caffeine has a number of negative health
effects, including but not limited to making you chronically anxious.

So?


He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

Spicy foods do not cause IBS. Spicy foods will aggravate an existing
IBS situation. The cause of IBS inmost cases is grains, specifically
wheat with gluten. He was not correct on this point. He was dead wrong
in advocating human consumption of excessive amounts of grains. Get
this thru your thick neaderthal skull. KELLOGG WAS WRONG ABOUT THE
CAUSES AND THE TREATMENT OF IBS.


And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

He advocated vegetarianism, which is WRONG. Humans need animal sourced
foods to achieve even a modicum of good health.

Wrong. You are eating seconded handed what you need.


So, you are totally ignorant of the concentrations of certain oils in fish
and ESSENTIAL amino acids in all meats.
Humans were created (whether you assume God or Evolution) as omnivores.
Science says so.
The Jewish and "Christian" scriptures say so.
Back to top
Mr-Natural-Health
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 01 May 2005
Posts: 1807

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 9:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

vernon wrote:
Quote:
"Jan Drew" <jdrew1374@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Gnarg.116454$H71.99698@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...

"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152196477.258789.90420@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Mark Thorson wrote:
On the other hand, he also attacked coffee,
white sugar, white flour, meat, and spicy
foods.

He attacked alcohol, coffee, and tea. I would say despite the
so-called benefits of green tea any product that contains caffeine will
be bad for your health. Caffeine has a number of negative health
effects, including but not limited to making you chronically anxious.

So?


He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

Spicy foods do not cause IBS. Spicy foods will aggravate an existing
IBS situation. The cause of IBS inmost cases is grains, specifically
wheat with gluten. He was not correct on this point. He was dead wrong
in advocating human consumption of excessive amounts of grains. Get
this thru your thick neaderthal skull. KELLOGG WAS WRONG ABOUT THE
CAUSES AND THE TREATMENT OF IBS.


And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

He advocated vegetarianism, which is WRONG. Humans need animal sourced
foods to achieve even a modicum of good health.

Wrong. You are eating seconded handed what you need.


So, you are totally ignorant of the concentrations of certain oils in fish
and ESSENTIAL amino acids in all meats.
Humans were created (whether you assume God or Evolution) as omnivores.
Science says so.
The Jewish and "Christian" scriptures say so.

Ever hear of the fish toxin called Mercury?

You have my condolences, Geek!
Back to top
Mr-Natural-Health
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 01 May 2005
Posts: 1807

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 9:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

Mark Thorson wrote:

Quote:
If we were to search for a 19th century advocate
of therapies that might warrant revival (or at
least scientific testing), I would suggest
reviewing the work of S. Weir-Mitchell.

Would that be Silas's raping his hysterical female patients? Setting
their bedsheets on fire? Or, are you talking about his rest cure? YOU
people need about 2 months bed rest before you end up losing it.

Science Geeks should always endeavor to be more precise.

I am reading _Notes on Nursing_ tonight by Florence Nightingale.

You Geeks should feel free beat up on each other while I accomplish
some more important work.

Just thought that you might want to know, that I know, you know. Smile
Back to top
Rob
medicine forum beginner


Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 12:25 am    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Quote:
Ever hear of the fish toxin called Mercury?

You have my condolences, Geek!

Hah! We are witnessing John's conversion to vegetarianism! I didn't
think you were the religious type Mr. Natural "Health".

RBR
Back to top
vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 3:26 am    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

"RBR" <ruddyr@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:1152231939.474221.102650@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
Quote:

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Ever hear of the fish toxin called Mercury?

You have my condolences, Geek!

Hah! We are witnessing John's conversion to vegetarianism! I didn't
think you were the religious type Mr. Natural "Health".

RBR


"Fish toxin", now that is really good :>) :>) :>)
Back to top
\"Jan Drew\"
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 02 Mar 2006
Posts: 353

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:19 am    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44ad782f$0$24194$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...
Quote:

"Jan Drew" <jdrew1374@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Gnarg.116454$H71.99698@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...

"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152196477.258789.90420@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Mark Thorson wrote:
On the other hand, he also attacked coffee,
white sugar, white flour, meat, and spicy
foods.

He attacked alcohol, coffee, and tea. I would say despite the
so-called benefits of green tea any product that contains caffeine will
be bad for your health. Caffeine has a number of negative health
effects, including but not limited to making you chronically anxious.

So?


He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

Spicy foods do not cause IBS. Spicy foods will aggravate an existing
IBS situation. The cause of IBS inmost cases is grains, specifically
wheat with gluten. He was not correct on this point. He was dead wrong
in advocating human consumption of excessive amounts of grains. Get
this thru your thick neaderthal skull. KELLOGG WAS WRONG ABOUT THE
CAUSES AND THE TREATMENT OF IBS.


And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

He advocated vegetarianism, which is WRONG. Humans need animal sourced
foods to achieve even a modicum of good health.

Wrong. You are eating seconded handed what you need.


So, you are totally ignorant of the concentrations of certain oils in fish
and ESSENTIAL amino acids in all meats.

No. Like I said..you are eating seconded handed.

ALL Essential Amino Acids come from plants.

They can be in combination of cereal grains ,wheat, corn, rice, and legumes
beans and nuts.

Quote:
Humans were created (whether you assume God or Evolution) as omnivores.
Science says so.
The Jewish and "Christian" scriptures say so.

The scriptures say:

Gen:1: 11Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing
plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to
their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants
bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in
it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

Behold I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of
all
the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding
seed;
to you it shall be for meat." Genesis 1:29.


"Thou shall eat the herb of the field." Genesis 3:18


An explanation.

http://www.naturesbestnews.com/godsplan.htm


We believe that "In the beginning God created ... man and woman." We also
believe that when God created us that He made us unique, with the freedom to
choose. And yet how could we choose without gaining information. He gave us
the
information we needed to choose wisely, unfortunately, throughout history,
we
have a reputation of disregarding God's wisdom and instead following our own
foolish ideas. This is in regard to whom we would follow right down the line
to
what would be important to us. This included what we would eat, drink and
how
we would live. God told us to eat the "seed-bearing plant on the face of the
whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it", Genesis 1:29, in
other words, fruits, seeds, nuts and grains. (By the way, He gave the green
plants for the animals to eat.) We were to eat in addition the fruit from
the
tree of life. From these foods, we would receive all the nourishment we
would
need to live forever. After the fall, however, we would no longer have
access
to the tree of life, and thus would no longer live forever. At that time God
told us to add to our diet the plants of the field, greens, vegetables,
Genesis
3:18. This addition would replace the necessary nutrients, needed for a
healthy
body, (not an everlasting one),that we would no longer be receiving from the
tree of life.. On this diet, man lived to an average age of 912 years
without a
single recorded instance of sickness! It was not until after the flood, when
man had grown so wicked that God regretted creating man and so destroyed the
earth, that God gave permission for man to eat certain meats that were to be
prepared in certain ways. In less that 10 generations on this type of
lifestyle, man's average age went from 912 to 100 years of age. Today that
average is about 70! What we are encouraging is for us to return to the
lifestyle God originally told us to follow for good health. In so doing, we
believe that we can give our bodies the nutrients that God created us as
needing, in order to rebuild our much depleted immune system and also to
build
healthy cells for a healthier body.


I believe this explanation to be correct. YMMV.

There will be naysayers who will say it is sales hype.
Back to top
TC
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 1814

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 2:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

Jan Drew wrote:
Quote:
"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44ad782f$0$24194$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"Jan Drew" <jdrew1374@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Gnarg.116454$H71.99698@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...

"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152196477.258789.90420@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Mark Thorson wrote:
On the other hand, he also attacked coffee,
white sugar, white flour, meat, and spicy
foods.

He attacked alcohol, coffee, and tea. I would say despite the
so-called benefits of green tea any product that contains caffeine will
be bad for your health. Caffeine has a number of negative health
effects, including but not limited to making you chronically anxious.

So?


He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

Spicy foods do not cause IBS. Spicy foods will aggravate an existing
IBS situation. The cause of IBS inmost cases is grains, specifically
wheat with gluten. He was not correct on this point. He was dead wrong
in advocating human consumption of excessive amounts of grains. Get
this thru your thick neaderthal skull. KELLOGG WAS WRONG ABOUT THE
CAUSES AND THE TREATMENT OF IBS.


And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

He advocated vegetarianism, which is WRONG. Humans need animal sourced
foods to achieve even a modicum of good health.

Wrong. You are eating seconded handed what you need.


So, you are totally ignorant of the concentrations of certain oils in fish
and ESSENTIAL amino acids in all meats.

No. Like I said..you are eating seconded handed.

ALL Essential Amino Acids come from plants.

They can be in combination of cereal grains ,wheat, corn, rice, and legumes
beans and nuts.

Humans were created (whether you assume God or Evolution) as omnivores.
Science says so.
The Jewish and "Christian" scriptures say so.

The scriptures say:

Gen:1: 11Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing
plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to
their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants
bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in
it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

Behold I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of
all
the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding
seed;
to you it shall be for meat." Genesis 1:29.


"Thou shall eat the herb of the field." Genesis 3:18


An explanation.

http://www.naturesbestnews.com/godsplan.htm


We believe that "In the beginning God created ... man and woman." We also
believe that when God created us that He made us unique, with the freedom to
choose. And yet how could we choose without gaining information. He gave us
the
information we needed to choose wisely, unfortunately, throughout history,
we
have a reputation of disregarding God's wisdom and instead following our own
foolish ideas. This is in regard to whom we would follow right down the line
to
what would be important to us. This included what we would eat, drink and
how
we would live. God told us to eat the "seed-bearing plant on the face of the
whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it", Genesis 1:29, in
other words, fruits, seeds, nuts and grains. (By the way, He gave the green
plants for the animals to eat.) We were to eat in addition the fruit from
the
tree of life. From these foods, we would receive all the nourishment we
would
need to live forever. After the fall, however, we would no longer have
access
to the tree of life, and thus would no longer live forever. At that time God
told us to add to our diet the plants of the field, greens, vegetables,
Genesis
3:18. This addition would replace the necessary nutrients, needed for a
healthy
body, (not an everlasting one),that we would no longer be receiving from the
tree of life.. On this diet, man lived to an average age of 912 years
without a
single recorded instance of sickness! It was not until after the flood, when
man had grown so wicked that God regretted creating man and so destroyed the
earth, that God gave permission for man to eat certain meats that were to be
prepared in certain ways. In less that 10 generations on this type of
lifestyle, man's average age went from 912 to 100 years of age. Today that
average is about 70! What we are encouraging is for us to return to the
lifestyle God originally told us to follow for good health. In so doing, we
believe that we can give our bodies the nutrients that God created us as
needing, in order to rebuild our much depleted immune system and also to
build
healthy cells for a healthier body.


I believe this explanation to be correct. YMMV.

There will be naysayers who will say it is sales hype.

Thank you for so clearly illustrating one of my main points, which is
that religious zealotry has no place in science, medicine or nutrition.
Do you still adhere to the flat earth principle as well?

TC
Back to top
TC
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 1814

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 2:08 pm    Post subject: Myths and truths about vegetarianism Reply with quote

Jan Drew wrote:
Quote:

No. Like I said..you are eating seconded handed.

ALL Essential Amino Acids come from plants.

They can be in combination of cereal grains ,wheat, corn, rice, and legumes
beans and nuts.

Humans were created (whether you assume God or Evolution) as omnivores.
Science says so.
The Jewish and "Christian" scriptures say so.

The scriptures say:

Gen:1: 11Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing
plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to
their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants
bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in
it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

Behold I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of
all
the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding
seed;
to you it shall be for meat." Genesis 1:29.


"Thou shall eat the herb of the field." Genesis 3:18


An explanation.

http://www.naturesbestnews.com/godsplan.htm


We believe that "In the beginning God created ... man and woman." We also
believe that when God created us that He made us unique, with the freedom to
choose. And yet how could we choose without gaining information. He gave us
the
information we needed to choose wisely, unfortunately, throughout history,
we
have a reputation of disregarding God's wisdom and instead following our own
foolish ideas. This is in regard to whom we would follow right down the line
to
what would be important to us. This included what we would eat, drink and
how
we would live. God told us to eat the "seed-bearing plant on the face of the
whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it", Genesis 1:29, in
other words, fruits, seeds, nuts and grains. (By the way, He gave the green
plants for the animals to eat.) We were to eat in addition the fruit from
the
tree of life. From these foods, we would receive all the nourishment we
would
need to live forever. After the fall, however, we would no longer have
access
to the tree of life, and thus would no longer live forever. At that time God
told us to add to our diet the plants of the field, greens, vegetables,
Genesis
3:18. This addition would replace the necessary nutrients, needed for a
healthy
body, (not an everlasting one),that we would no longer be receiving from the
tree of life.. On this diet, man lived to an average age of 912 years
without a
single recorded instance of sickness! It was not until after the flood, when
man had grown so wicked that God regretted creating man and so destroyed the
earth, that God gave permission for man to eat certain meats that were to be
prepared in certain ways. In less that 10 generations on this type of
lifestyle, man's average age went from 912 to 100 years of age. Today that
average is about 70! What we are encouraging is for us to return to the
lifestyle God originally told us to follow for good health. In so doing, we
believe that we can give our bodies the nutrients that God created us as
needing, in order to rebuild our much depleted immune system and also to
build
healthy cells for a healthier body.


I believe this explanation to be correct. YMMV.

There will be naysayers who will say it is sales hype.

http://www.westonaprice.org/mythstruths/mtvegetarianism.html

TC
Back to top
vernon
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 405

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 2:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

"Jan Drew" <jdrew1374@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:3amrg.163$2v.22@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...
Quote:

"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44ad782f$0$24194$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"Jan Drew" <jdrew1374@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Gnarg.116454$H71.99698@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...

"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152196477.258789.90420@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Mark Thorson wrote:
On the other hand, he also attacked coffee,
white sugar, white flour, meat, and spicy
foods.

He attacked alcohol, coffee, and tea. I would say despite the
so-called benefits of green tea any product that contains caffeine
will
be bad for your health. Caffeine has a number of negative health
effects, including but not limited to making you chronically anxious.

So?


He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

Spicy foods do not cause IBS. Spicy foods will aggravate an existing
IBS situation. The cause of IBS inmost cases is grains, specifically
wheat with gluten. He was not correct on this point. He was dead wrong
in advocating human consumption of excessive amounts of grains. Get
this thru your thick neaderthal skull. KELLOGG WAS WRONG ABOUT THE
CAUSES AND THE TREATMENT OF IBS.


And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against
meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

He advocated vegetarianism, which is WRONG. Humans need animal sourced
foods to achieve even a modicum of good health.

Wrong. You are eating seconded handed what you need.


So, you are totally ignorant of the concentrations of certain oils in
fish and ESSENTIAL amino acids in all meats.

No. Like I said..you are eating seconded handed.

GOOD plants feed on manure. SO?
Poor plants are not fed manure.

Quote:
ALL Essential Amino Acids come from plants.

GOOD plants feed on manure.
NO plant or group of plants provides humans with all of the essential amino
acids, regardless of what you "religion" says.

Quote:

They can be in combination of cereal grains ,wheat, corn, rice, and
legumes beans and nuts.

Humans were created (whether you assume God or Evolution) as omnivores.
Science says so.
The Jewish and "Christian" scriptures say so.

The scriptures say:

Eat EVERY thing.

Jesus made fun of those who were selective. Maintenance of health in the
desert or in the Egyptian world of poisons is not general health.
Back to top
Mr-Natural-Health
medicine forum Guru


Joined: 01 May 2005
Posts: 1807

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 2:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Introducing John Harvey Kellogg, the undisputed Father of Natural Health Reply with quote

Jan Drew wrote:
Quote:
"vernon" <there@there> wrote in message
news:44ad782f$0$24194$88260bb3@news-taz.teranews.com...

"Jan Drew" <jdrew1374@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Gnarg.116454$H71.99698@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...

"TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1152196477.258789.90420@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...

Mr. Natural-Health wrote:
Mark Thorson wrote:
On the other hand, he also attacked coffee,
white sugar, white flour, meat, and spicy
foods.

He attacked alcohol, coffee, and tea. I would say despite the
so-called benefits of green tea any product that contains caffeine will
be bad for your health. Caffeine has a number of negative health
effects, including but not limited to making you chronically anxious.

So?


He was against spicy foods. And, I say that he was mainly saying that
anyone suffering from IBS should not eat spicy foods. And, he was
totally correct on that point.

Spicy foods do not cause IBS. Spicy foods will aggravate an existing
IBS situation. The cause of IBS inmost cases is grains, specifically
wheat with gluten. He was not correct on this point. He was dead wrong
in advocating human consumption of excessive amounts of grains. Get
this thru your thick neaderthal skull. KELLOGG WAS WRONG ABOUT THE
CAUSES AND THE TREATMENT OF IBS.


And, the ONLY negative thing that Kellogg really ever said against meat
was that nobody should be eating disease ridden meat. Meat in his day
was usually disease ridden and that is precisely why so many people
back then were bilious or suffering from IBS.

He advocated vegetarianism, which is WRONG. Humans need animal sourced
foods to achieve even a modicum of good health.

Wrong. You are eating seconded handed what you need.


So, you are totally ignorant of the concentrations of certain oils in fish
and ESSENTIAL amino acids in all meats.

No. Like I said..you are eating seconded handed.

ALL Essential Amino Acids come from plants.

They can be in combination of cereal grains ,wheat, corn, rice, and legumes
beans and nuts.

Humans were created (whether you assume God or Evolution) as omnivores.
Science says so.
The Jewish and "Christian" scriptures say so.

The scriptures say:

Gen:1: 11Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing
plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to
their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants
bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in
it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

Behold I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of
all
the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding
seed;
to you it shall be for meat." Genesis 1:29.


"Thou shall eat the herb of the field." Genesis 3:18


An explanation.

http://www.naturesbestnews.com/godsplan.htm


We believe that "In the beginning God created ... man and woman." We also
believe that when God created us that He made us unique, with the freedom to
choose. And yet how could we choose without gaining information. He gave us
the
information we needed to choose wisely, unfortunately, throughout history,
we
have a reputation of disregarding God's wisdom and instead following our own
foolish ideas. This is in regard to whom we would follow right down the line
to
what would be important to us. This included what we would eat, drink and
how
we would live. God told us to eat the "seed-bearing plant on the face of the
whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it", Genesis 1:29, in
other words, fruits, seeds, nuts and grains. (By the way, He gave the green
plants for the animals to eat.) We were to eat in addition the fruit from
the
tree of life. From these foods, we would receive all the nourishment we
would
need to live forever. After the fall, however, we would no longer have
access
to the tree of life, and thus would no longer live forever. At that time God
told us to add to our diet the plants of the field, greens, vegetables,
Genesis
3:18. This addition would replace the necessary nutrients, needed for a
healthy
body, (not an everlasting one),that we would no longer be receiving from the
tree of life.. On this diet, man lived to an average age of 912 years
without a
single recorded instance of sickness! It was not until after the flood, when
man had grown so wicked that God regretted creating man and so destroyed the
earth, that God gave permission for man to eat certain meats that were to be
prepared in certain ways. In less that 10 generations on this type of
lifestyle, man's average age went from 912 to 100 years of age. Today that
average is about 70! What we are encouraging is for us to return to the
lifestyle God originally told us to follow for good health. In so doing, we
believe that we can give our bodies the nutrients that God created us as
needing, in order to rebuild our much depleted immune system and also to
build
healthy cells for a healthier body.


I believe this explanation to be correct. YMMV.

There will be naysayers who will say it is sales hype.

Would you mind repeating that? Except this time in plain English.
Back to top
Google

Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 2 of 5 [61 Posts] Goto page:  Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5 Next
View previous topic :: View next topic
The time now is Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:45 pm | All times are GMT
Forum index » Medicine forums » nursing
Jump to:  

Similar Topics
Topic Author Forum Replies Last Post
No new posts 76 Ways Sugar Can Ruin Your Health TC nutrition 8 Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:41 pm
No new posts Help with health diet stryped@hotmail.com nutrition 1 Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:53 pm
No new posts Diet question (Not about looseing wieght but for health) stryped@hotmail.com cardiology 4 Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:52 pm
No new posts Nurses and Home Health Aids Needed respitehunter nursing 0 Thu Jul 06, 2006 5:38 pm
No new posts Cancer drug versus natural substances ironjustice@aol.com nutrition 4 Thu Jul 06, 2006 9:38 am

Copyright © 2004-2005 DeniX Solutions SRL
Other DeniX Solutions sites: email marketing campaigns , electronics forum, Science forum, Unix/Linux blog, Unix/Linux documentation, Unix/Linux forums


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
[ Time: 0.0339s ][ Queries: 16 (0.0027s) ][ GZIP on - Debug on ]