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Juhana Harju
medicine forum Guru
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1056
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 Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 3:58 am Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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msamson11975@yahoo.ca wrote:
: For anyone that wants more reading about the dangers of fish oil:
You are misinformed.
--
Juhana |
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Just Cocky
medicine forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 11 Aug 2005
Posts: 297
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 4:12 am Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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On Fri, 9 Jun 2006 06:58:03 +0300, "Juhana Harju"
<shantigiriorama@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
msamson11975@yahoo.ca wrote:
: For anyone that wants more reading about the dangers of fish oil:
You are misinformed.
|
Nah, it's just his brain shutting down for lack of DHA.
--
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are
cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt"
-- Bertrand Russell |
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Matti Narkia
medicine forum Guru
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Posts: 425
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 10:13 am Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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On 8 Jun 2006 20:38:14 -0700, "msamson11975@yahoo.ca"
<msamson11975@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Your sources are awful. Search for Medline (www.pubmed.gov>) studies
about fish, fish oil, EPA, DHA, omega-3 (n-3) fatty acids and cancer
or coronary heart disease or cardiovascular disease in general, and
you will find they heve been associated with a reduced risk of cancer,
CHD and CVD. The only exception is alpha-linolenic acid, which has
been positively associated with prostate cancer, but with no other
cancers. And even alpha-linolenic acid is inversely associated with
CHD and CVD.
--
Matti Narkia |
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msamson11975@yahoo.ca
medicine forum addict
Joined: 03 Jun 2006
Posts: 97
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 2:51 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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| Quote: |
Nah, it's just his brain shutting down for lack of DHA.
--
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are
cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt"
-- Bertrand Russell
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Actually I eat fish every other day, but thanks for your concern. |
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msamson11975@yahoo.ca
medicine forum addict
Joined: 03 Jun 2006
Posts: 97
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 2:52 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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Juhana Harju wrote:
| Quote: | msamson11975@yahoo.ca wrote:
: For anyone that wants more reading about the dangers of fish oil:
You are misinformed.
--
Juhana
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Nice one. Don't even bother eloborating. |
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msamson11975@yahoo.ca
medicine forum addict
Joined: 03 Jun 2006
Posts: 97
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 2:53 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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| Quote: | Your sources are awful. Search for Medline (www.pubmed.gov>) studies
about fish, fish oil, EPA, DHA, omega-3 (n-3) fatty acids and cancer
or coronary heart disease or cardiovascular disease in general, and
you will find they heve been associated with a reduced risk of cancer,
CHD and CVD. The only exception is alpha-linolenic acid, which has
been positively associated with prostate cancer, but with no other
cancers. And even alpha-linolenic acid is inversely associated with
CHD and CVD.
--
Matti Narkia
|
I have extensively searched medline. Many studies state that long term
safety and eficacy is unknown and results are inconclusive. They don't
have a clue what is happening at the molecular level and it may cause
alot more harm than good.
Safest bet is to eat whole fish. This is no magic bullet...maybe if
you are already suffering from CVD, but not in healthy people. |
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Juhana Harju
medicine forum Guru
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1056
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 3:25 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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msamson11975@yahoo.ca wrote:
: Juhana Harju wrote:
:: msamson11975@yahoo.ca wrote:
::
::: For anyone that wants more reading about the dangers of fish oil:
::
:: You are misinformed.
:
: eloborating.
What the heck is that?
--
Juhana |
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Matti Narkia
medicine forum Guru
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Posts: 425
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 3:41 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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On 9 Jun 2006 07:53:55 -0700, "msamson11975@yahoo.ca"
<msamson11975@yahoo.ca> wrote:
| Quote: |
Your sources are awful. Search for Medline (www.pubmed.gov>) studies
about fish, fish oil, EPA, DHA, omega-3 (n-3) fatty acids and cancer
or coronary heart disease or cardiovascular disease in general, and
you will find they heve been associated with a reduced risk of cancer,
CHD and CVD. The only exception is alpha-linolenic acid, which has
been positively associated with prostate cancer, but with no other
cancers. And even alpha-linolenic acid is inversely associated with
CHD and CVD.
I have extensively searched medline.
|
If so, why don't you cite Medline references instead those crappy
sources you cited in your earlier message?
| Quote: | Many studies state that long term
safety and eficacy is unknown and results are inconclusive. They don't
have a clue what is happening at the molecular level and it may cause
alot more harm than good.
Safest bet is to eat whole fish. This is no magic bullet...maybe if
you are already suffering from CVD, but not in healthy people.
|
_Fatty_ fish and fish oil are just fine for healthy people as well.
IMHO, small fatty fish eaten as a whole such as sardines are
preferable, because in addition to healthy omega-3s you get also quite
a bit of taurine and calcium. Some fish, especially mackerel and
herring have also a lot of phosphatidylserine, which is good for aging
brain, and sardines and mackerel are good sources of coenzyme Q10.
But if you don't like or tolerate fish, or can't get sufficiently
pollution free fish, fish oil is just fine. It inhibits
vasoconstriction and cardiac arrhythmias, so it may be good idea to
take some fish oil with meals on those days you don't eat fish.
--
Matti Narkia |
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Just Cocky
medicine forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 11 Aug 2005
Posts: 297
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 4:49 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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On 9 Jun 2006 07:51:33 -0700, "msamson11975@yahoo.ca"
<msamson11975@yahoo.ca> wrote:
| Quote: |
Nah, it's just his brain shutting down for lack of DHA.
Actually I eat fish every other day, but thanks for your concern.
|
Why are you eating fish if fish oil is such a bad thing?
--
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are
cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt"
-- Bertrand Russell |
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msamson11975@yahoo.ca
medicine forum addict
Joined: 03 Jun 2006
Posts: 97
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:20 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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Matti Narkia wrote:
| Quote: | If so, why don't you cite Medline references instead those crappy
sources you cited in your earlier message?
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How much money can be made by proving that concentrated fish oil
supplements are harmful?
| Quote: | IMHO, small fatty fish eaten as a whole such as sardines are
preferable, because in addition to healthy omega-3s you get also quite
a bit of taurine and calcium. Some fish, especially mackerel and
herring have also a lot of phosphatidylserine, which is good for aging
brain, and sardines and mackerel are good sources of coenzyme Q10.
|
Thank you. This is all i'm saying.
| Quote: | But if you don't like or tolerate fish, or can't get sufficiently
pollution free fish, fish oil is just fine. It inhibits
vasoconstriction and cardiac arrhythmias, so it may be good idea to
take some fish oil with meals on those days you don't eat fish.
|
I'm sorry, there are no short cuts in life. Don't think that there
isn't some sort of rebound effect. Concentrated fish oil lacks all
supporting structures of the fish (as you mentioned above) and has a
big oxidative effect. Perhaps the saturated fat, and other components
of fish help mitigate this. |
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msamson11975@yahoo.ca
medicine forum addict
Joined: 03 Jun 2006
Posts: 97
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:21 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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Just Cocky wrote:
Why are you eating fish if fish oil is such a bad thing?
Since when is eating a whole food with all it's supporting structures
in place (proteins, saturated fats, vitamins, etc) comparable to a
highly processed concentrated source of one fatty acid?? |
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Just Cocky
medicine forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 11 Aug 2005
Posts: 297
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 7:51 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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On 9 Jun 2006 10:21:54 -0700, "msamson11975@yahoo.ca"
<msamson11975@yahoo.ca> wrote:
| Quote: |
Just Cocky wrote:
Why are you eating fish if fish oil is such a bad thing?
Since when is eating a whole food with all it's supporting structures
in place (proteins, saturated fats, vitamins, etc) comparable to a
highly processed concentrated source of one fatty acid??
|
If fish oil is bad, how come fish oil plus a bunch of proteins,
saturated fats, vitamins, etc is suddenly good? And do you think that
people who take fish oil caps don't eat anything else? What's wrong
with a steak plus fish oil caps?
--
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are
cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt"
-- Bertrand Russell |
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Just Cocky
medicine forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 11 Aug 2005
Posts: 297
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 7:52 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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On 9 Jun 2006 10:20:43 -0700, "msamson11975@yahoo.ca"
<msamson11975@yahoo.ca> wrote:
| Quote: |
Matti Narkia wrote:
If so, why don't you cite Medline references instead those crappy
sources you cited in your earlier message?
How much money can be made by proving that concentrated fish oil
supplements are harmful?
|
Plenty. Pharmaceutical companies hate good stuff they can't patent.
--
"The trouble with the world is that the stupid are
cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt"
-- Bertrand Russell |
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| Back to top |
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Juhana Harju
medicine forum Guru
Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 1056
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 8:01 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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Just Cocky wrote:
: On 9 Jun 2006 10:20:43 -0700, "msamson11975@yahoo.ca"
: <msamson11975@yahoo.ca> wrote:
:: Matti Narkia wrote:
::
::: If so, why don't you cite Medline references instead those crappy
::: sources you cited in your earlier message?
::
:: How much money can be made by proving that concentrated fish oil
:: supplements are harmful?
: :
: Plenty. Pharmaceutical companies hate good stuff they can't patent.
Exactly. It is very profitable for pharmaceutical companies if they can make
up a study which would show that fish oils reduce mortality less than e.g.
statins.
--
Juhana |
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Will Brink
medicine forum addict
Joined: 11 Mar 2005
Posts: 83
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| Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 8:04 pm Post subject:
Re: Fish Oil Processing
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In article <1149864835.361698.249760@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
"msamson11975@yahoo.ca" <msamson11975@yahoo.ca> wrote:
| Quote: | Your sources are awful. Search for Medline (www.pubmed.gov>) studies
about fish, fish oil, EPA, DHA, omega-3 (n-3) fatty acids and cancer
or coronary heart disease or cardiovascular disease in general, and
you will find they heve been associated with a reduced risk of cancer,
CHD and CVD. The only exception is alpha-linolenic acid, which has
been positively associated with prostate cancer, but with no other
cancers. And even alpha-linolenic acid is inversely associated with
CHD and CVD.
--
Matti Narkia
I have extensively searched medline.
|
And clearly didn't understand a thing you read there. Searching med line
does not make one a scientist or qualified to make science/medical
conclusions. What's your science or medical background? Let me take a
WAG here and say you have essentially zero training in this area.
| Quote: | Many studies state that long term
safety and eficacy is unknown and results are inconclusive. They don't
have a clue what is happening at the molecular level and it may cause
alot more harm than good.
|
That would be wrong.
--
Will Brink @ www.BrinkZone.com |
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